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Qtec
11-21-2011, 04:53 AM
link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6AdDLhPwpp4)

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/411179/thumbs/s-OCCUPY-WALL-STREET-large300.jpg

Is the USA now a police state?

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/411593/LIZ-NICHOLS-OCCUPY-PORTLAND-PEPPER-SPRAY.jpg

Q

LWW
11-21-2011, 05:24 AM
The law allows for peaceful assembly.

Blocking public sidewalks and interfering with the right to us public property by other citizens is not peaceful assembly.

When the police tell you to move and you refuse, you are risking arrest. When the police attempt to physically arrest you and you resist, that's called resisting arrest snoopy. D'UH!

If you want to see what police brutality actually looks like, with the typical racism tossed in, I will gladly educate you.

>>> SNOOPY, CLICK THIS LINE OF TEXT. IT IS A LINK TO A VIDEO OF ACTUAL POLICE ABUSE OF POWER<<< (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8J7ejEkxNQ)

Qtec
11-21-2011, 05:41 AM
HaHaHaHa................Was that it?

Your boys. link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFQQGfIuF1k)

Q

Qtec
11-21-2011, 05:44 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The law allows for peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> Yes it does. Italso says you have the right to protest.</span>

Blocking public sidewalks and interfering with the right to us public property by other citizens is not peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> It was on campus O brainless one.</span>

When the police tell you to move and you refuse, you are risking arrest.<span style="color: #990000"> That is a possibility.</span> When the police attempt to physically arrest you and you resist, that's called resisting arrest snoopy. D'UH! </div></div>

So????????????????????????


Q



Q

LWW
11-21-2011, 05:47 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body">HaHaHaHa................Was that it?

Your boys. link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFQQGfIuF1k)

Q </div></div>

Why are you deflecting?

LWW
11-21-2011, 05:51 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The law allows for peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> Yes it does. Italso says you have the right to protest.</span> <span style="color: #3366FF">There right to protest was not infringed ... their stifling of the rights of others to use a public thoroughfare was.</span>

Blocking public sidewalks and interfering with the right to us public property by other citizens is not peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> It was on campus O brainless one.</span> <span style="color: #3366FF">Why do you feel the need to resort to ad hominem attacks? In addition ... what does it being on campus have to do with it? Are you implying other students don't have any rights?</span>

When the police tell you to move and you refuse, you are risking arrest.<span style="color: #990000"> That is a possibility.</span> <span style="color: #3366FF">No, it is a reality.</span> When the police attempt to physically arrest you and you resist, that's called resisting arrest snoopy. D'UH! </div></div>

So????????????????????????

Carry on, you almost made a point. <span style="color: #3366FF">And it is circling over your head as we speak.</span>

Q </div></div>

Next deflection?

Gayle in MD
11-21-2011, 07:31 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The law allows for peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> Yes it does. Italso says you have the right to protest.</span>

Blocking public sidewalks and interfering with the right to us public property by other citizens is not peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> It was on campus O brainless one.</span>

When the police tell you to move and you refuse, you are risking arrest.<span style="color: #990000"> That is a possibility.</span> When the police attempt to physically arrest you and you resist, that's called resisting arrest snoopy. D'UH! </div></div>

So????????????????????????


Q



Q </div></div>

And If Nixon was still in office they would probably be shooting and killing the protesting students again.

What we're seeing is an ogranized RW attack, on students who were sitting in silence, being assaulted by the police...the RW establishment doesn't like their message, because it hits the mark.



"If you don't have a job, don't blame the banks, blame yourself!"
Lying idiot Herman Cain's repulsive statement!


"Go get a job right after you take a bath"

Pig Gingrich's repulsive statement. One of the filthiest commonest people to ever take part in the political arena.

A lying Hypocrite extraordinaire, who got nearly two million dollars from Freddie Mac, $30 plus thousand a month, that he calls payment for being a historian? then he rails about sending Barney Frank, who took part in the first legislation to reign in corruption and then banking and ratings corruption, should go to jail! After Gingrich himself, was paid to use his influence with the Congress, to do their bidding?

Repiglicans refuse to engage on the subject of the existing immorality of the Repiglican policies of income inequality of this country, because their policies, which they refuse to change, created it.

Job Killer Romney? Lying his ass off at every turn. Non stop double talk and lies about his own flip flopping, the say anything to get elected, Hypocrite extraordinaire!

I just hope Americans are watching and listening.


G.

eg8r
11-21-2011, 08:27 AM
That second picture is pretty awesome. My little point and shoot would never take that good of a picture.

eg8r

eg8r
11-21-2011, 08:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It was on campus O brainless one.
</div></div>So why isn't Obama taking care of this outrage? LOL, because qtip thinks if you are on "campus" you can ignore the law.

eg8r

eg8r
11-21-2011, 08:30 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And If Nixon was still in office they would probably be shooting and killing the protesting students again.
</div></div>LOL, Nixon in office protesting students are shot and killed. Good thing Nixon was booted out. Obama is in office and protesting kids are pepper sprayed. Will he get the boot or is pepper spraying "innocent" kids acceptable?

eg8r

Gayle in MD
11-21-2011, 08:37 AM
Bravo OWS UCDavis Students!

Watch the exit of UCDavis Katehi, who hid in her office, afraid to leave the campus....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/20/linda-katehi-uc-davis_n_1103916.html

Gayle in MD
11-21-2011, 08:41 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And If Nixon was still in office they would probably be shooting and killing the protesting students again.
</div></div>LOL, Nixon in office protesting students are shot and killed. Good thing Nixon was booted out. Obama is in office and protesting kids are pepper sprayed. Will he get the boot or is pepper spraying "innocent" kids acceptable?

eg8r </div></div>

Idiot!

Nixon called in the "National Guard killers who shot the students.

President Obama has had nothing to do with any of the Repiglican attacks on OWS protestors, anywhere.

Another stupid post that proves your ignorance.

G.

Gayle in MD
11-21-2011, 08:42 AM
They weren't breaking any laws. They were having a sit-in, sitting silently in a row, when they were assaulted. The behavior of those officers was reprehensible. But then, you always defend reprehensive irrational behavior that hurts others.

Those officers should be placed on leave immeidately until an investigation is completed.



<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Militarization Of Campus Police


Yesterday, police at UC Davis attacked seated students with a chemical gas.

I teach at UC Davis and I personally know many of the students who were the victims of this brutal and unprovoked assault. They are top students. In fact, I can report that among the students I know, the higher a student's grade point average, the more likely it is that they are centrally involved in the protests.

This is not surprising, since what is at issue is the dismantling of public education in California. Just six years ago, tuition at the University of California was $5357. Tuition is currently $12,192. According to current proposals, it will be $22,068 by 2015-2016. We have discussed this in my classes, and about one third of my students report that their families would likely have to pull them out of school at the new tuition. It is not a happy moment when the students look around the room and see who it is that will disappear from campus. These are young people who, like college students everywhere and at all times, form some of the deepest friendships they will have in their lives.

This is what motivates students who have never taken part in any sort of social protest to "occupy" the campus quad. And indeed, there were students who were attacked with chemical agents by robocops who were engaging in their first civic protest.

Since the video of the assault has gone viral, I will assume that most of you have seen the shocking footage. Let's take a look at the equally outrageous explanations and justifications that have come from UC Davis authorities.

UC Davis Chancellor Linda P.B. Katehi sent a letter to the university last night. Chancellor Katehi tells us that:

The group was informed in writing... that if they did not dismantle the encampment, it would have to be removed... However a number of protestors refused our warning, offering us no option but to ask the police to assist in their removal.
No other options? The list of options is endless. To begin with, the chancellor could have thanked them for their sense of civic duty. The occupation could have been turned into a teach-in on the role of public education in this country. There could have been a call for professors to hold classes on the quad. The list of "other options" is endless.

Chancellor Katehi asserts that "the encampment raised serious health and safety concerns." Really? Twenty tents on the quad "raised serious health and safety concerns?" Has the chancellor been to a frat party lately? Or a football game? Talk about "serious health and safety concerns."

How about this for another option: three years ago there was a very similar occupation of the quad at Columbia University in New York City by students protesting the way the expansion of the university was displacing residents in the neighborhood. There was a core group of twenty or thirty students there around the clock. At the high points there were 200-300. The administration met with the students and held serious discussions about their concerns. And after a couple of weeks the protest had run its course and the students took the tents down. The most severe action that was even contemplated on the part of the university was to expel students who were hunger striking, under a rule that allows the school to expel students who are considered a threat to themselves. But no one was actually expelled.

Remember when universities used to expel students instead of spray them with chemical agents?

We should also note that at Columbia, a private university, the campus police carry no arms and no pepper spray. This is what Columbia University police look like when arresting students:


</div></div>


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/20/joe-walsh-veterans-in-occ_n_1104421.html?ir=Politics
G.

LWW
11-21-2011, 12:23 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And If Nixon was still in office they would probably be shooting and killing the protesting students again.
</div></div>LOL, Nixon in office protesting students are shot and killed. Good thing Nixon was booted out. Obama is in office and protesting kids are pepper sprayed. Will he get the boot or is pepper spraying "innocent" kids acceptable?

eg8r </div></div>

Idiot!

Nixon called in the "National Guard killers who shot the students.

G. </div></div>

That's precious ... the dumbest cluck on the board calling someone else an idiot.

In spite of the song lyrics, Nixon did not call in the NG at Kent State ... Kent mayor Leroy Satrom called Ohio gubmer Kames Rhoades and requested the Ohio NG be sent in.

Gayle in MD
11-21-2011, 04:40 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And If Nixon was still in office they would probably be shooting and killing the protesting students again.
</div></div>LOL, Nixon in office protesting students are shot and killed. Good thing Nixon was booted out. Obama is in office and protesting kids are pepper sprayed. Will he get the boot or is pepper spraying "innocent" kids acceptable?

eg8r </div></div>

Idiot!

Nixon called in the "National Guard killers who shot the students.

President Obama has had nothing to do with any of the Repiglican attacks on OWS protestors, anywhere.

Another stupid post that proves your ignorance.

G. </div></div>


<span style='font-size: 11pt'>
In 1970, in response to Nixon's widening of the Vietnam War into Cambodia, students throughout the US protested. Nixon sent the National Guard to restore order to the Kent State campus. The resulting consequences changed the course of the war.</span>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyzoNCJvy4c





<span style='font-size: 14pt'>May 1, 1970 - President Nixon calls anti-war students "bums blowing up campuses."</span>


http://www.historyplace.com/unitedstates/vietnam/index-1969.html

eg8r
11-21-2011, 05:03 PM
LOL, your post was the idiotic one, I just played along. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

eg8r

Qtec
11-22-2011, 01:26 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It was on campus O brainless one.
</div></div>So why isn't Obama taking care of this outrage? LOL, because qtip <u>thinks if you are on "campus" you can ignore the law.</u>

eg8r </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> UC Davis police officials said officers used pepper spray on Occupy protesters on campus Friday after the demonstrators had <u>surrounded officers.</u>

Police said the officers were trying to get out of the protest area when they used the pepper spray.

UC Davis Police Chief Annette Spicuzza told reporters Saturday that the decision to use the pepper spray was made at the scene. "<span style='font-size: 14pt'>The students had encircled the officers</span>," she said. "They needed to exit. They were looking to leave but were <u>unable to get out.</u>"</div></div>

That's not what I saw. What I saw was a crime being committed on American students who posed no threat. Neither did Grandma.

http://thatswhatsupnow.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/8ee9b061c30da719fe0e6a70670014e3granma1.jpg

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Two people were killed in Cairo and Alexandria this weekend as Egyptian activists took the streets to protest the military's attempts to maintain its grip on power. <span style='font-size: 14pt'>And guess how the state is justifying its deadly crackdown.</span>

<span style='font-size: 20pt'>"We saw the firm stance the US took against OWS people & the German govt against green protesters to secure the state,"</span> an Egyptian state television anchor said yesterday </div></div>

Yep, that's the USA, spreading democracy by example.

Q

LWW
11-22-2011, 05:46 AM
Again ... song lyrics are not actual history.

For the terminally stupid among us:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The next day, Saturday, May 2, Mayor Satrom met with other city officials and a representative of the Ohio National Guard who had been dispatched to Kent. Mayor Satrom then made the decision to ask Governor Rhodes to send the Ohio National Guard to Kent. The mayor feared further disturbances in Kent based upon the events of the previous evening, but more disturbing to the mayor were threats that had been made to downtown businesses and city officials as well as rumors that radical revolutionaries were in Kent to destroy the city and the university. Satrom was fearful that local forces would be inadequate to meet the potential disturbances, and thus about 5 p.m. he called the Governor's office to make an official request for assistance from the Ohio National Guard.

Members of the Ohio National Guard were already on duty in Northeast Ohio, and thus they were able to be mobilized quickly to move to Kent. As the Guard arrived in Kent at about 10 p.m. </div></div>

&gt;&gt;&gt;JUMPING BUTTERBALLS&lt;&lt;&lt; (http://dept.kent.edu/sociology/lewis/lewihen.htm)

LWW
11-22-2011, 05:47 AM
Why are you deflecting again?

What have you to say against the actual police state that exists in your homeland?

Qtec
11-22-2011, 06:47 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why are you deflecting again?

What have you to say against the actual police state that exists in your homeland? </div></div>

Listen up snoopy. Check out the topic of the thread.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 20pt'>UC Davis Protestors </span>Pepper Sprayed </div></div>

If you agree with what the police did, say so. If you disagree, say so. This has nothing to do with Obama, flying saucers, the price of fish or what happens somewhere else in the world.

You are the one deflecting., Chicken Little! Ha.

Q

Gayle in MD
11-22-2011, 07:06 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The law allows for peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> Yes it does. Italso says you have the right to protest.</span>

Blocking public sidewalks and interfering with the right to us public property by other citizens is not peaceful assembly.<span style="color: #990000"> It was on campus O brainless one.</span>

When the police tell you to move and you refuse, you are risking arrest.<span style="color: #990000"> That is a possibility.</span> When the police attempt to physically arrest you and you resist, that's called resisting arrest snoopy. D'UH! </div></div>

So????????????????????????


Q



Q </div></div>

Our country for the most part is outraged over what those officers did to those students.

The Chancellor of the University, herself, apologized, and has stated her own outrage over what those cops did to those students.

Commentators from the right and the l;eft, have written op-eds condemning this incident.

The officers who performed the vicious attack on the students have been placed on administrative leave.

Yet, two radical RW idiotic jerks on this forum defend what those disgusting P's OS did.

Reasonable people have made their decisions about the unfair treatment of those peaceful students, who were demonstrating against higher college costs, more robbing by the top, of the Middle Class.

The authoritarian combative nature of some obviously sicko officers of the law, who have no respect for their fellow Americans, would be applauded by unAmerican RW radicals like the two here who are defending this outrageous behavior.

We obviously have two RW radical, authoritarian loving sheep....on this forum, nutjobs....both of them out of touch with reality.

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

eg8r
11-22-2011, 08:27 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's not what I saw. What I saw was a crime being committed on American students who posed no threat. Neither did Grandma.
</div></div>I am sure that isn't what you saw. It is those pictures of the truth that you choose to ignore in pursuit of your next lie.

eg8r

Qtec
11-23-2011, 04:18 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That second picture is pretty awesome. My little point and shoot would never take that good of a picture.

eg8r </div></div>

I take a lot of pics with my phone. They are sometimes reasonable quality but these days the good camera's are really good. The mega-pixels are just going up and up.

Autumn in Rotterdam. Very misty. link (https://picasaweb.google.com/104081090532012287452/23November2011#)


Q...the dog is not allowed to chase the pigeons. [ much as he wants to!] /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif It not a good idea when you live in the city.

LWW
11-23-2011, 05:18 AM
Sorry snoopdawg ... you asked a question:

<span style='font-size: 26pt'>Is the USA now a police state?</span>

I answered it.

Ever since you have been running from the fact that it is you that live in a police state, where even the police cower in fear of the Islamic thug movement.

Why don't y'all stand up for your own freedom?

What's that?

Y'all aren't allowed to own weapons because your king says he doesn't trust you with them?

That pretty much explains it.

LWW
11-23-2011, 05:19 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That second picture is pretty awesome. My little point and shoot would never take that good of a picture.

eg8r </div></div>

I take a lot of pics with my phone. They are sometimes reasonable quality but these days the good camera's are really good. The mega-pixels are just going up and up.

Autumn in Rotterdam. Very misty. link (https://picasaweb.google.com/104081090532012287452/23November2011#)


Q...the dog is not allowed to chase the pigeons. [ much as he wants to!] /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif It not a good idea when you live in the city.

</div></div>

Talk about going off topic ... and, FWIW, your comments on photography reveal yet another topic you know next to nothing about.

Gayle in MD
11-23-2011, 06:42 AM
Beautiful.

Awe, picture ten is so cute, looks like he's thinking "Pleeeeze daddy, can I pleeeze chase the birds...'

/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Gayle in MD
11-23-2011, 06:49 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And If Nixon was still in office they would probably be shooting and killing the protesting students again.
</div></div>LOL, Nixon in office protesting students are shot and killed. Good thing Nixon was booted out. Obama is in office and protesting kids are pepper sprayed. Will he get the boot or is pepper spraying "innocent" kids acceptable?

eg8r </div></div>

Idiot!

Nixon called in the "National Guard killers who shot the students.

G. </div></div>

That's precious ... the dumbest cluck on the board calling someone else an idiot.

In spite of the song lyrics, Nixon did not call in the NG at Kent State ... Kent mayor Leroy Satrom called Ohio gubmer Kames Rhoades and requested the Ohio NG be sent in. </div></div>

Just saw your post of irrational ignorance....another of many which prove your stupidity.

Nixon's M.O. was calling the students who were outraged over his gross lies and irrational foreign policies, and peacefully demonstrating on college campuses....."Bums"...

Additionally, his role was proven in his taped recordings...and stated by Nixon himself.

But as we all know, IIARIOK....hence, Tea Party Nutjobs get away with spitting on Representatives, turning up at their Koch Brothers financed protests, with guns strapped to their legs, even when the POTUS is precent, and displaying their signage of racism and hate, as they threaten to come back and shoot later, and they are defended by idiots like you and Ed.......while students who assemple peacefully are trashed by your irrational, radical RW rhetoric.

Typical RW Sheep...Bah, Bah, Bah...no sense of fairness, or logic.
G.

LWW
11-23-2011, 08:32 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Additionally, his role was proven in his taped recordings...and stated by Nixon himself.

G. </div></div>


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <span style='font-size: 14pt'>NOW you should provide a link moron</span>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Q </div></div>

Gayle in MD
11-23-2011, 09:08 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[quote=Gayle in MD]Additionally, his role was proven in his taped recordings...and stated by Nixon himself.

G. </div></div>


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <span style='font-size: 14pt'>NOW you should provide a link moron</span>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Q </div></div>






Are you too stupid to find the Nixon tapes?

I guess I can believe that easily enough.

Richard Nixon was as responsible as those who shot the students....

His nasty rheotric about the student demonstrations, calling them bums, railing against them at every chance, rhetoric that led to the overreaction that day, shooting down young college kids in cold blood...


http://speccoll.library.kent.edu/4may70/MissionBetrayed.htm

Several books indicate deeper involvement by Nixon, as well. I can't give you links, because I read them back when the lies were out there, being spread around by the Nixon Administration, which tried the best they could to prevent any investigations.

The Nixon lies and hate which permeated this country until we finally got the goods on the crook called Nixon, were instrumental in what happened at Kent.

As far as I'm concerned, Nixon was just as responsible for those lost lives as the idiot Repiglican who called out the National Guard....in fact, Nixon himself, famously asked that very question of his Aides....himself...not that I think YOU would ever have read about it.

MORON!

G.

LWW
11-23-2011, 09:18 AM
How about you cut and paste the specific section where it verifies that Nixon either ordered the NG to Kent State or that he ordered the shooting.

These were your claims:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nixon called in the "National Guard killers who shot the students.

G. </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Additionally, his role was proven in his taped recordings...and stated by Nixon himself.

G. </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[<span style='font-size: 11pt'>In 1970, in response to Nixon's widening of the Vietnam War into Cambodia, students throughout the US protested. Nixon sent the National Guard to restore order to the Kent State campus.</span></div></div>

FWIW ... your link says the exact opposite.

But, I have an unfair advantage being that I actually read what it says.

It's a shame your agit-prop brain feels it must resort to name calling when presented with an opportunity to learn something.

Gayle in MD
11-23-2011, 09:26 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about you cut and paste the specific section where it verifies that Nixon either ordered the NG to Kent State or that he ordered the shooting.

FWIW ... your link says the exact opposite.

But, I have an unfair advantage being that I actually read what it says. </div></div>

Nixon did not send them in, officially...as I stated, originally, if he were rpesident, they would have been shooting these students dead, insteald of assaulting them for peacefully demonstrating.

Nixon ceated the hateful rhetoric which IMO led to the overreaction by those National Guardsmen.

I was wrong to say that nixon sent them in, but as I am stating, even Nixon himself, questioned the degree to which his hateful rehtoric contributed to their deaths, and that is on tape.

So I was wrong to say that Nixon actually sent them in, although I have read many books written back during that time, which suggest that Nixon tried to block any investigations, due to private conversatsions and public statements, which made him look as responsible as I and many others, believe he was, for what happened at Kent State...

End of story.

G.

LWW
11-23-2011, 09:29 AM
Where did you learn to ride a bicycle in reverse with such skill?

LWW
11-23-2011, 09:33 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nixon himself, questioned the degree to which his hateful rehtoric contributed to their deaths, and that is on tape.

G. </div></div>

Then provide the quote with the link.

LWW
11-23-2011, 09:34 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So I was wrong to say that Nixon actually sent them in, although I have read many books written back during that time, which suggest that Nixon tried to block any investigations, due to private conversatsions and public statements, which made him look as responsible as I and many others, believe he was, for what happened at Kent State...

G. </div></div>

What books?

LWW
11-23-2011, 09:35 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gayle in MD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">End of story.

G. </div></div>

There never was a story ... only moonbat mythology based on nothing more than song lyrics and seditious demokrook lies.

LWW
11-23-2011, 10:05 AM
Since you have been in this thread again, and posted elsewhere since, it's obvious that you made that up also.

Soflasnapper
11-23-2011, 08:03 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The law allows for peaceful assembly.

Blocking public sidewalks and interfering with the right to us public property by other citizens is not peaceful assembly.

When the police tell you to move and you refuse, you are risking arrest. When the police attempt to physically arrest you and you resist, that's called resisting arrest snoopy. D'UH!

If you want to see what police brutality actually looks like, with the typical racism tossed in, I will gladly educate you.

&gt;&gt;&gt; SNOOPY, CLICK THIS LINE OF TEXT. IT IS A LINK TO A VIDEO OF ACTUAL POLICE ABUSE OF POWER&lt;&lt;&lt; (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8J7ejEkxNQ)
</div></div>

I agree with you on this one. I've been surprised that these demonstrations have not been ended sooner. That's the general rule of law in our country as has been applied for decades. Demonstrators are severely limited as to time and place, and camping out and dominating public areas and access has never been allowed here, generally.

That said, I'd still call the police use of pepper spray an abuse of process and authority, especially on seated, peaceful and docile protestors. That does represent a semi-police state ratcheting up the pain, and for no apparent sensible reason I can think of.

However, it's the same with the overuse/abuse of tasing, which I find abhorrent. Evidently not unlawful, but it ought to be made illegal in my view, unless subject to rigorous terms of engagement.

Qtec
11-24-2011, 01:25 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I agree with you on this one. I've been surprised that these demonstrations have not been ended sooner. That's the general rule of law in our country as has been applied for decades. Demonstrators are severely limited as to time and place, and camping out and dominating public areas and access has never been allowed here, generally.
</div></div>

That might change.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Into this muted crowd of young protesters strides Ronald Reagan with his movie star make-up and million-dollar smile. Even as we shout at him, he waves like a prom king to his court. It makes no sense to me, this disconnect between Reagan's royal entrance and the protesting peons. No sense, that is, until I watch the evening news and see my first experience with "the spin." On those brief video clips, our small gaggle of protesters looks like a cheering crowd. Our grimaces look like chimpanzee smiles, our signs are gone, our voices are silenced. It might as well be a promo or puff piece for the governor and his anti-intellectual policies.

I've never forgotten that 1960s media manipulation. The movie star governor who knew how to frame a scene and work the camera angles, if not the crowd. It got him all the way to the presidency.

But as I watched the UC Davis protesters I realized there was actually some hope -- and change since my protest days at UCD. Everyone was a camera and no one could spin it or cut it or censor it. That's because all the students were raising their smart phone cameras to witness and document the scene. So as the campus police doused the peaceful protesters, there was heart-breaking audio:

"Don't do it! Don't do it!"

"Do you have children?" a young man asked the cop as he sprayed students in the face with the blinding chemical pepper.

"Your children would be ashamed of you!" a young woman cried out.

And the uncut video showed the faces of the police as they stood by, refusing to help when students screamed out in pain, rubbing their eyes, coughing. It was so counter-intuitive to see these public servants causing the harm, not rescuing us. And their faces were not stoic masks. Some of the police looked very confused, even ashamed.

"Shame on you!" the crowd began chanting. "You can go!"

And the campus police began retreating slowly. There is no winning here in the video. But there is something quite profound and ground-breaking: The role of the citizen witness. Our sixties generation had no technology to document our revolution. We had to rely upon the mainstream media with its censors, editors, and gate-keepers to report on any protest.

Today's young are so media and tech-savvy that everyone with a smart phone is a reporter and a witness. The Internet's egalitarian social media has replaced the top-down reporting. YouTube can spark revolutions and organize protests. A wall of policemen is so 20th century with it show of force and dictatorial power. The 21st century is about relationship, not top-down authority. It's why all over the world dictators are falling. </div></div>

link (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brenda-peterson/uc-davis-protests_b_1108179.html)

Q

LWW
11-24-2011, 05:38 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That said, I'd still call the police use of pepper spray an abuse of process and authority, especially on seated, peaceful and docile protestors. That does represent a semi-police state ratcheting up the pain, and for no apparent sensible reason I can think of.</div></div>

Really?

Let's actually look at the photos:

PHOTO #1:

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/411179/thumbs/s-OCCUPY-WALL-STREET-large300.jpg

What do we actually see here? Protesters sitting across a public sidewalk, and several deep. In conjunction with that, we have protesters lining the sidewalk.

This clearly impedes the right of non protesting citizens to pass freely.

Orders were issued to stop the blocking of a public walkway. They were ignored.

It is the duty of the LEO's to at that point enforce the law.

Would you have preferred the use of batons? Tasers? Dogs? Tear gas? Rubber bullets? Sound cannons?

All of the other tactics have the ability to cause more harm than pepper spray. Some have the capacity to injure non involved citizens.

If you wish to criticize what the police did, surely you have a suggestion as to what they should have done as an alternative?

LWW
11-24-2011, 05:49 AM
PHOTO 2:

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/411593/LIZ-NICHOLS-OCCUPY-PORTLAND-PEPPER-SPRAY.jpg

What do we see here?

Most all of the protesters leaning in towards the police line. To the right of the lady getting sprayed we have a protester with shoulder turned towards the line in an aggressive stance. Next to the right we have a guy with a ski cap arm extended pushing into the line. To the right of him, as well as behind him, we see a surge forward from the crowd.

As to the spraying, it obviously didn't begin until the crowd decided to assault the line.

Now, I'll grant you that the protesters are seriously overmatched in this confrontation ... but what should the police have done? Be trampled? Allow their asses to be kicked? Open fire? Turn and run? Tolerate anarchy? Split heads with batons?

Again, if you wish to criticize the police actions, surely you have an alternative and viable tactic to suggest.

Police violence is not illegal, nor should it be, when it is directed at those who resist arrest ... disobey lawful commands ... or initiate violence.

Any reasonable viewer of these events will clearly see that the police used the minimal amount of force required to both ensure their safety and enforce the law.

Qtec
11-25-2011, 02:39 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This clearly impedes the right of non protesting citizens to pass freely.

Orders were issued to stop the blocking of a public walkway. They were ignored.

It is the duty of the LEO's to at that point enforce the law. </div></div>

If that's the law , they are subject to arrest, not torture. Did you see the police trying to arrest anyone before the spraying?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would you have preferred the use of batons? Tasers? Dogs? Tear gas? Rubber bullets? Sound cannons? </div></div>

Why would you assume that these are reasonable methods to be used against non-violent peaceful protesters?

Q

LWW
11-25-2011, 05:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This clearly impedes the right of non protesting citizens to pass freely.

Orders were issued to stop the blocking of a public walkway. They were ignored.

It is the duty of the LEO's to at that point enforce the law. </div></div>

If that's the law , they are subject to arrest, not torture. Did you see the police trying to arrest anyone before the spraying?

Q </div></div>

They resisted arrest ... that's the point snoopy.

Try to keep up.

LWW
11-25-2011, 05:22 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Would you have preferred the use of batons? Tasers? Dogs? Tear gas? Rubber bullets? Sound cannons? </div></div>

Why would you assume that these are reasonable methods to be used against non-violent peaceful protesters?

Q </div></div>

And straight to the lies you go.

I, as you know, never said these were reasonable acts ... I asked what alternatives the left would suggest.

And, of course, you had none ... and instinctively resorted to Alinskyism by demanding that I defend a position I never took.

What a tool you are.

Qtec
11-25-2011, 05:27 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">They resisted arrest . </div></div>

1. Where is your proof?

2. Even if they did, that still doesn't give the police the right to pepper spray them.

Q

LWW
11-25-2011, 05:35 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">They resisted arrest . </div></div>

1. Where is your proof?

Q

</div></div>

In your opening post.

LWW
11-25-2011, 05:39 AM
[quote=Qtec] <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">2. Even if they did, that still doesn't give the police the right to pepper spray them.

Q

</div></div>

So you knew that they did, and yes the police do have the right at that point.

In fact at the 2nd picture, they had the right to use greater force.

BTW ... do you even know what pepper spray is?

Qtec
11-25-2011, 06:24 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW ... do you even know what pepper spray is? </div></div>

Of course I do, its a food product!

link (http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201111210021?frontpage)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Fox's Megyn Kelly: Pepper Spray Used On UC-Davis Protesters Is "A Food Product, Essentially" </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="color: #990000">2. Even if they did, that still doesn't give the police the right to pepper spray them.

Q</span>



So you knew that they did, and<u> yes the police do have the right at that point.</u> </div></div>

No they don't.

Pepper spray and the tazer were introduced as an alternative to shooting people, it was never meant for crowd compliance.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Rachel Maddow discussed what she believed was the violent nature of "nonlethal weapons" on her Monday show.

Maddow was speaking after a string of Occupy protesters in various cities across the United States had been significantly injured by police.

Iraq War veteran Scott Olsen at Occupy Oakland was hit in the head with a police projectile after tear gas was used to disperse protesters. Olsen suffered a fractured skull. Seattle's Dorli Rainey, the 84-year-old woman who participated in the Occupy protests, became an internet sensation after footage of police pepper spraying her went viral. Most recently, police at UC Davis repeatedly pepper-sprayed peaceful protesters who were sitting with linked arms during an Occupy demonstration.

Maddow took viewers through a variety of "nonlethal weapons" that, according to her, "are not meant to kill you, even if they hurt so bad you wish they did." Maddow said the argument for using these types of weapons, such as taser guns, was that those "in the military field and the criminal justice field...switch from a gun to a nonlethal means to getting what [they] want without using deadly force."

Maddow further argued that nonlethal weaponry was not used often as a substitute for lethal force, but rather "increases the number of occasions [and] types of occasions when force is used at all." She contrasted this concept with the aforementioned Occupy incidents in which protesters were significantly injured despite police using "nonlethal" means.

Maddow said that "new weapons with new uses mean that [police] have the opportunity to use force a lot more than [they] did before." She further hammed this point and said, "Without having pepper spray as an option, I cannot believe that Seattle police would have shot 84-year-old Dorli Rainey. Without tear gas, Oakland police would not have shot Iraq war veteran, Scott Olsen. Without pepper spray, UC Davis campus police, I do not think, would have shot those 11 protesters with live ammunition." She added that <span style='font-size: 20pt'>"because police have these nonlethal ways to use force, they used it."</span> Maddow called this "the day-to-day reality of the protesters in the Occupy Wall Street movement across the country right now."</div></div>

watch (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/22/rachel-maddow-occupy-police_n_1107322.html?ref=media)

Q

eg8r
11-25-2011, 04:35 PM
Yeah my phone gets the call the majority of the time for me. One thing to be careful about is to get caught up in the megapixel race. Megapixels are not the whole story. I don't know nearly enough to explain it but the image sensor plays a huge role considering two different cameras with the same pixel count but different sensor. CMOS vs CCD, and on and on. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

The new iPhone from what I understand while still having 8mp as other smartphones the picture quality is still better. I haven't compared it though, just rumors.

eg8r

eg8r
11-25-2011, 04:37 PM
No reason for such pointed remarks in a post that was meant to cordial. Yes we are off topic because the main topic gets enough coverage.

eg8r

LWW
11-25-2011, 05:13 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Pepper spray and the tazer were introduced as an alternative to shooting people ...

Q </div></div>

And that's how it was used.

Now, again, if you are going to criticize the police ... what <span style='font-size: 11pt'><u>should</u></span> they have done?

Beat them?

Taze them?

Shoot them?

If someone refuses to cooperate with law enforcement ... how do you suggest they handle it?

So far your answer seems to be to let them get away with it.

LWW
11-25-2011, 05:16 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yeah my phone gets the call the majority of the time for me. One thing to be careful about is to get caught up in the megapixel race. Megapixels are not the whole story. I don't know nearly enough to explain it but the image sensor plays a huge role considering two different cameras with the same pixel count but different sensor.

eg8r </div></div>

The only thing the MP count means is how large you can enlarge a photo.

Glass and sensor are far more important, especially if you are above 6 MP or so.

A 1,000 MP photo taken through crap class onto a cheap sensor will simply yield the ability to do a huge enlargement of a really cheap and crap photo.

Soflasnapper
11-25-2011, 06:34 PM
I have already said I expect the police to clear the area under local government orders.

It is my opinion that the tactics used were unnecessary and indiscriminate. They may have both necessary and targeted, had certain individuals resisted. Which they did not.

Going limp or linking arms is not resistance sufficient to prompt this response. In my opinion. Opinions vary, obviously, but gustibus non disputandam.

I think they should have individually picked off that line of protestors one by one with an officer or two or three, handcuffed them, and done that without batons, dogs, fire hoses, rubber bullets, pepper spray pods, or pepper spray, unless and until there was violent resistance.

There is little doubt in my mind that had these people been Tea Party protestors, far more anger at this treatment would be on display, and probably from you, calling this police state thug action. It has that appearance and odor about it.

LWW
11-28-2011, 03:57 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It is my opinion that the tactics used were unnecessary and indiscriminate. </div></div>

Yet none of you has offered up an alternative response.

LWW
11-28-2011, 03:59 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">They may have both necessary and targeted, had certain individuals resisted. Which they did not.</div></div>

Evidence from the scene disputes that.

Imagine that.

LWW
11-28-2011, 04:07 AM
EVEN THE PROTESTERS (http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/11/24/uc-davis-student-admits-protesters-surrounded-cops-and-wouldnt-let-th) dispute the spoon fed myth that you so desperately cling to.

The evidence clearly shows that when ordered to disperse, the protesters encircled the police and refused to let them leave peacefully.

But, since Robespierre, the left has loved the mob as a political tool.

Qtec
11-28-2011, 05:01 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Pepper spray and the tazer were introduced as an alternative to shooting people ...

Q </div></div>

And that's how it was used. <span style="color: #990000">LOL Are you now saying if you sit down and refuse to get up you should be shot! You are quite the little Thug, aren't you?</span>

Now, again, if you are going to criticize the police ... what <span style='font-size: 11pt'><u>should</u></span> they have done?
<span style="color: #990000">Emmmmmmmmmm...arrested them?</span>

Beat them?

Taze them?

Shoot them?

If someone refuses to cooperate with law enforcement ... how do you suggest they handle it?<span style="color: #990000"> The amount of force used when making an arrest should be proportionate to the amount of resistance. The video shows quite clearly that no attempt was made at arresting them. The got sprayed because they did not comply with the commands from the Thugocracy! HaHa I thought you were against the Thugocracy?</span>

So far your answer seems to be to let them get away with it. </div></div>

That is also an alternative. The banks got away with it.

Q

LWW
11-28-2011, 06:28 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Qtec</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Pepper spray and the tazer were introduced as an alternative to shooting people ...

Q </div></div>

And that's how it was used. <span style="color: #990000">LOL Are you now saying if you sit down and refuse to get up you should be shot! You are quite the little Thug, aren't you?</span>

Now, again, if you are going to criticize the police ... what <span style='font-size: 11pt'><u>should</u></span> they have done?
<span style="color: #990000">Emmmmmmmmmm...arrested them?</span> <span style="color: #3333FF">They did clueless one ... which led to them resisting arrest which led to pepper spraying. So, what was your point ... other than to reinforce what a fool you truly are?</span>

Beat them?

Taze them?

Shoot them?

If someone refuses to cooperate with law enforcement ... how do you suggest they handle it?<span style="color: #990000"> The amount of force used when making an arrest should be proportionate to the amount of resistance. The video shows quite clearly that no attempt was made at arresting them. The got sprayed because they did not comply with the commands from the Thugocracy! HaHa I thought you were against the Thugocracy?</span> <span style="color: #3333FF">If you would watch the video, you would understand that it was the protesters who surrounded the police and impeded their ability to even leave. That's a felony in it's own right. You not knowing this simply proves one of the many risks of letting someone else tell you what your "OPINION" is. </span>

So far your answer seems to be to let them get away with it. </div></div>

That is also an alternative. The banks got away with it. <span style="color: #3333FF">Where were the bankers?</span>

Q </div></div>

Dance some more for us.