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llotter
02-12-2012, 05:16 PM
The 'compromise' conjured up by The Moron with the Catholics and others who cling to religion over government simply states, by edict, that specific services will be provided by the insurance companies for free. The 'free lunch' that government has made available to nearly everyone for decades is now coming to the private sector. This is surely a big step to making everything available for free and make liars out of all of us that have tried to say that is no 'free lunch'. Ya learn something everyday.

cushioncrawler
02-12-2012, 10:37 PM
I dont hav breakfast. And i dont hav lunch (but i might hav a banana).

Iz there any theory about free dinners????
If not, then i might google bananas.
mac.

LWW
02-13-2012, 03:47 AM
It is amazing that the nutty 25% cannot comprehend that nothing is free.

Qtec
02-13-2012, 06:13 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It is amazing that the nutty 25% cannot comprehend that nothing is free. </div></div>

Do health insurers want their clients to get pregnant? Its in the numbers.

Q

LWW
02-13-2012, 06:29 AM
I don't think they care either way.

Qtec
02-13-2012, 06:56 AM
What costs less?

Paying for contraception or paying for an unwanted pregnancy?

One costs maybe $200 cost price, the other might well be $100,000!

Work it out Snoopy.

Q

Soflasnapper
02-13-2012, 12:31 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It is amazing that the nutty 25% cannot comprehend that nothing is free. </div></div>

Providing certain things 'free of charge' does cost something, of course. That's not unheard of even now-- given insurance policies may very well provide some services without co-pays or deductibles, as for instance, having an oral exam and teeth cleaning annually as part of a dental health insurance program. (I think that's how mine works, e.g.)

But the truth is, that even with the cost of providing these 'free' services, the costs can be lower than without the insurance bearing these costs, and that is exactly why this is a feature of some existing insurance plans right now.

In the dental case just mentioned, the cost of an hour of a dental hygienist would be a fraction of the cost of an extraction, treating the situation of a bad gingivitis situation, doing a necessary implant or providing discounted pricing on dental caps, etc.

Tell me, do you change the oil in your car regularly? A small price to avoid ruining your engine. Something insurance companies already know, and have implemented, quite before this health care reform mandate, which simply extends the principle to those insurance companies and benefit provisions that haven't done this already.

LWW
02-13-2012, 02:02 PM
Why don't I have a right to a regular oil change?

Is not transportation a basic human need?

Now that I have applied your logic on health care as an analogy to auto maintenance ... let's go the other way?

Is not the majority of things people expect for "FREE" as part of health care actually nothing more than maintenance?

Soflasnapper
02-13-2012, 05:35 PM
You can buy some cars which carry a no-cost oil change for the warranty period, together with no-cost provisions for all service items. These cars are very expensive, however, so 'free' is quite expensive!

However, in countries with 'free' health care services (paid for out of the taxpayers' money, of course, but 'free' as to additional charges when services of the system are used), that care is actually cheaper, at well under half our per capita spending levels, with comparable or better outcomes.

I don't think most people in this country expect anything free about health care, other than the Medicaid beneficiaries, as most insurance carries co-pays and annual deductibles for all services. Sometimes this is de minimus, as in a $10 or $20 co-pay per (minor) service, but deductibles run into the hundreds with normal insurance, and into the thousands for catastrophic policies.

No, there is no currently acknowledged or advocate right to transportation, and particularly, no right to a car, let alone to free oil changes.

Yes, these preventative care matters and routine annual screenings are a kind of maintenance, but maintenance of health related to the right to life.

eg8r
02-13-2012, 06:00 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can buy some cars which carry a no-cost oil change for the warranty period, together with no-cost provisions for all service items. These cars are very expensive, however, so 'free' is quite expensive!
</div></div>So how long will it take before you start campaigning with Obama to have free oil changes for everyone. On top of that, a free quarterly $30 check mailed to all those people who don't have cars?

eg8r

Soflasnapper
02-13-2012, 06:22 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can buy some cars which carry a no-cost oil change for the warranty period, together with no-cost provisions for all service items. These cars are very expensive, however, so 'free' is quite expensive!
</div></div>So how long will it take before you start campaigning with Obama to have free oil changes for everyone. On top of that, a free quarterly $30 check mailed to all those people who don't have cars?

eg8r </div></div>

Nixon advocated a negative income tax, essentially a guaranteed minimum income from the state. He got that idea from Milton Friedman.

The proponents of the FAIR tax, with its 'prebate,' also advocate for a very large monthly stipend paid from the government, which would be among the largest entitlement type of transfer payments the government makes. Hundreds of billions of dollars.

So one was a long time ago, and the other, quite recent (within the last decade or so).

It might just happen, as both Friedman and the FAIR tax advocates are conservatives, and I doubt a lot of liberals would strongly object.

Qtec
02-13-2012, 07:10 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 14pt'>New Study: Health Care Costs Fall When Poor Get Health Care Coverage</span>

The concept of support for universal health care is taboo among Republicans who scrutinize the Affordable Care Act -- dubbing it the "Job-Killing Health Care Law Act" -- and call for its repeal. But a new UC Irvine study challenges the GOP argument that the health care law is too costly, with data illustrating that health care costs on the whole fall when poorer, uninsured patients are provided with insurance.

"In a case study involving low-income people enrolled in a community-based health insurance program, we found that use of primary care increased but use of emergency services fell, and -- over time -- total health care costs declined," David Neumark, a co-author of the study, said in a release accompanying the findings.

The study -- which focused on uninsured people in Richmond, Virginia who fell 200 percent below the poverty line -- found that over three years, health care costs fell by almost 50 percent per participant, from $8,899 in the first year to $4,569 in the third after they received insurance. Participants who enrolled in health coverage made fewer trips to the emergency room, which are notorious for running up patient bills. Instead, insured participants went for more primary care visits."A lot of the debate about health care reform surrounds the issue of whether we're setting up something that's going to cost us more by increasing use of medical services or something that will cut costs through more appropriate and timely use of medical services," Neumark said in the release. "[O]ver time, costs can be reduced through increased use of primary care and reductions in emergency-department visits and hospital admissions, but it may take several years of coverage for substantive savings to occur."

</div></div> link (http://crooksandliars.com/susie-madrak/new-study-health-care-costs-fall-when)

Common sense.


Q

llotter
02-14-2012, 02:56 AM
It is shameful that you folks on the left compare children with something that needs to be prevented like bad teeth. People with common sense. including insurance companies, know that the children are the future of everything, including future customers.

Anyone with common sense not only understands but can see in plain sight the nihilistic consequence of following such shortsighted thinking. Witness what has been happening to virtually every 'advanced' western society plus Russia and Japan that are now suffering from lack of sufficient number children to sustain themselves. And the Left is hell-bent on putting America on that same self-destructing path.

Just how stupid can the Left be? Open your eyes and see what is obvious to anyone with common sense.

Qtec
02-14-2012, 04:07 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> It is shameful that you folks on the left compare children </div></div>

What children? Primary does not = children in this context DIP$T%#!.

Q........geez

LWW
02-14-2012, 07:07 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can buy some cars which carry a no-cost oil change for the warranty period, together with no-cost provisions for all service items. These cars are very expensive, however, so 'free' is quite expensive!

However, in countries with 'free' health care services (paid for out of the taxpayers' money, of course, but 'free' as to additional charges when services of the system are used), that care is actually cheaper, at well under half our per capita spending levels, with comparable or better outcomes.

I don't think most people in this country expect anything free about health care, other than the Medicaid beneficiaries, as most insurance carries co-pays and annual deductibles for all services. Sometimes this is de minimus, as in a $10 or $20 co-pay per (minor) service, but deductibles run into the hundreds with normal insurance, and into the thousands for catastrophic policies.

No, there is no currently acknowledged or advocate right to transportation, and particularly, no right to a car, let alone to free oil changes.

Yes, these preventative care matters and routine annual screenings are a kind of maintenance, but maintenance of health related to the right to life.


</div></div>

So when do I get my check for the $2,500 reduction in healthcare premiums I was promised.

If I buy a BMW with "FREE" maintenance I may pay a lot ... but I at least get what I was promised.

eg8r
02-14-2012, 07:50 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It might just happen, as both Friedman and the FAIR tax advocates are conservatives, and I doubt a lot of liberals would strongly object. </div></div>So you think the Fair tax would get resounding approval?

eg8r

Soflasnapper
02-14-2012, 07:33 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: eg8r</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It might just happen, as both Friedman and the FAIR tax advocates are conservatives, and I doubt a lot of liberals would strongly object. </div></div>So you think the Fair tax would get resounding approval?

eg8r </div></div>

Actually, no. It would have to be revenue-neutral, or more likely, raise MORE money than the system in place, and I don't think those high required percentages would fly for most people.

Sev
02-14-2012, 07:47 PM
The question is why should I have to pay for contreception for other peoples recreational sex.

Generally when you engagin in a recreational activity you purchase or rent the equipment.

cushioncrawler
02-14-2012, 07:57 PM
Why not google at other people's sex on the net.
I guess that thats why its called Google.
mac.