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LWW
02-25-2012, 07:19 AM
Things which generally outrage leftists:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DiabloViejo</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH ...

http://www.webmastertalkforums.com/attachments/lounge/1598d1310788605-obama-just-like-hitler-yo.jpg

http://thetruthisnow.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/obama_hitler_stalin.jpg

http://i604.photobucket.com/albums/tt122/Goldyfan/obama/165207_190obama_nazi.jpg

http://www.canadafreepress.com/images/uploads/obama-nazi2.jpg

http://einhornpress.com/images/obama%20hitler.jpg

http://bajurtov.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/obama-arab-nazi.jpg

http://www.arcticbeacon.com/greg/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/obama-nazi-hitler-288x300.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_9VGZjBQHr0s/ScomgYdaS-I/AAAAAAAADAE/3mcs1YByfu4/s400/ObamaYouth2.jpg

</div></div>

LWW
02-25-2012, 07:24 AM
Things which generally do not outrage leftists:

http://nem1e99.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/bush_hitler.jpg
http://www.history.ucsb.edu/faculty/marcuse/classes/33d/projects/media/BushHitlerShitAsshole.jpg

http://www.geschichteinchronologie.ch/eu/ch/bankgeheimnis-schuetzt-diktatoren-d/001-Bush-Hitler-m-axt.JPG

http://earthhopenetwork.net/bush%20art/Bush-hitler-blair-mussolini.jpg

http://lygsbtd.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/bush-hitler1.jpg

http://www.infowars.com/images2/ps/Bush_-_HitlerFake.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_sQPBRF0DJjQ/SrmE4WHQogI/AAAAAAAAAJA/N4N77MRIJbc/s400/Bush_Hitler5.jpg

http://badexample.mu.nu/archives/bush%20satan.jpg
http://images5.cpcache.com/product/20997295v2_460x460_Front_Color-White.jpg
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2525/3733555835_93842ab9fe_z.jpg

LWW
02-25-2012, 07:33 AM
<span style='font-size: 26pt'>HMM</span><span style='font-size: 23pt'>MMM</span><span style='font-size: 20pt'>MMM</span><span style='font-size: 17pt'>MMM</span><span style='font-size: 14pt'>MMM</span><span style='font-size: 11pt'>MMM</span><span style='font-size: 8pt'>MMM</span><span style='font-size: 8pt'>MMM</span>...

Stretch
02-25-2012, 08:17 AM
We always knew that you identify yourself with extremists, nothing new here. Next outrage please. St.

Soflasnapper
02-25-2012, 11:02 AM
Sometimes, when the shoe fits, it must be worn.

Fact is, when you have the former chief prosecutor at Nuremburg stating that the Nuremburg standard, that aggressive war was the key war crime behind all other war crimes, had been breached by the actions of George W. Bush, the comparison was more apt than not.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <span style='font-size: 14pt'>Could Bush Be Prosecuted for War Crimes?</span>

A Nuremberg chief prosecutor says there is a case for trying Bush for the 'supreme crime against humanity, an illegal war of aggression against a sovereign nation.' </div></div>

Story here, from'06 (http://www.alternet.org/world/38604/)

For, WHO WAS IT who had promoted 'preventative war'?

Here's one claim that it was (cough, yes) Hitler himself:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All of us have heard this term "preventive war" since the earliest days of Hitler. I recall that is about the first time I heard it. In this day and time, if we believe for one second that nuclear fission and fusion, that type of weapon, would be used in such a war — what is a preventive war?

I would say a preventive war, if the words mean anything, is to wage some sort of quick police action in order that you might avoid a terrific cataclysm of destruction later.

A preventive war, to my mind, is an impossibility today. How could you have one if one of its features would be several cities lying in ruins, several cities where many, many thousands of people would be dead and injured and mangled, the transportation systems destroyed, sanitation implements and systems all gone? That isn't preventive war; that is war.

I don't believe there is such a thing; and, frankly, I wouldn't even listen to anyone seriously that came in and talked about such a thing.

... It seems to me that when, by definition, a term is just ridiculous in itself, there is no use in going any further.
There are all sorts of reasons, moral and political and everything else, against this theory, but it is so completely unthinkable in today's conditions that I thought it is no use to go any further. </div></div>

President Dwight D. Eisenhower, 1954 From Wikiquotes (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower)

LWW
02-26-2012, 07:11 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sometimes, when the shoe fits, it must be worn.

Fact is, when you have the former chief prosecutor at Nuremburg stating that the Nuremburg standard, that aggressive war was the key war crime behind all other war crimes, had been breached by the actions of George W. Bush, the comparison was more apt than not.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <span style='font-size: 14pt'>Could Bush Be Prosecuted for War Crimes?</span>

A Nuremberg chief prosecutor says there is a case for trying Bush for the 'supreme crime against humanity, an illegal war of aggression against a sovereign nation.' </div></div>

Story here, from'06 (http://www.alternet.org/world/38604/)

For, WHO WAS IT who had promoted 'preventative war'?

Here's one claim that it was (cough, yes) Hitler himself:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All of us have heard this term "preventive war" since the earliest days of Hitler. I recall that is about the first time I heard it. In this day and time, if we believe for one second that nuclear fission and fusion, that type of weapon, would be used in such a war — what is a preventive war?

I would say a preventive war, if the words mean anything, is to wage some sort of quick police action in order that you might avoid a terrific cataclysm of destruction later.

A preventive war, to my mind, is an impossibility today. How could you have one if one of its features would be several cities lying in ruins, several cities where many, many thousands of people would be dead and injured and mangled, the transportation systems destroyed, sanitation implements and systems all gone? That isn't preventive war; that is war.

I don't believe there is such a thing; and, frankly, I wouldn't even listen to anyone seriously that came in and talked about such a thing.

... It seems to me that when, by definition, a term is just ridiculous in itself, there is no use in going any further.
There are all sorts of reasons, moral and political and everything else, against this theory, but it is so completely unthinkable in today's conditions that I thought it is no use to go any further. </div></div>

President Dwight D. Eisenhower, 1954 From Wikiquotes (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower) </div></div>

Accepting all of that ... how would it make one offended at dear leader = Hitler analogies and not at Bush = Hitler analogies?

Dance some more for us now.

Soflasnapper
02-26-2012, 12:01 PM
Bush was proud to proclaim his doctrine of preventative war, and then engaged in one, in Iraq. Obama has not embraced that doctrine at all, and has not engaged in a preventative war.

When he invades a sovereign country with 200,000 troops and a large number of mercenaries, which invasions sees the deaths of over 1 million people in that country, displaces 4 million more, and etc., get back to me.

I do agree that Obama, like all post-WWII US presidents, has taken military actions that are probably illegal. But not yet at the level of enormity to justify the Hitler comparison, more in the mainstream of US presidents' military actions that fall short of that gold standard (even if they are illegal).

The invasions of Grenada and Panama, under Reagan and Bush Sr. respectively, were far more illegal and on a grander scale than anything Obama has done.

LWW
02-26-2012, 02:53 PM
So we didn't actually bomb and invade Pakistan nor bomb and invade Libya?

LWW
02-26-2012, 02:54 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bush was proud to proclaim his doctrine of preventative war, and then engaged in one, in Iraq. </div></div>

Are you seriously denying that Saddam repeatedly committed acts of war against the US?

Soflasnapper
02-26-2012, 05:07 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So we didn't actually bomb and invade Pakistan nor bomb and invade Libya? </div></div>

We bombed Libya, and drone-attacked in Pakistan, invading neither, of course.

Soflasnapper
02-26-2012, 05:12 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bush was proud to proclaim his doctrine of preventative war, and then engaged in one, in Iraq. </div></div>

Are you seriously denying that Saddam repeatedly committed acts of war against the US? </div></div>

Are you seriously claiming he did?

The worst thing he did we accepted meekly, although he did apologize, which was an apparently accidental attack on one of our destroyers or missile boats. But that was during the Iran/Iraq war hostilities, where we backed him, even after the evidence and claims that he'd gassed Kurds in the field (which was likely false), so he was our boy at the time.

There were fanciful reports that Iraq or Iraqi nationals at least were involved in the OKC Murraugh Building bombing, but those were not credible, in my view.

What else was there, supposedly? Sending money after the fact to <s>homicide</s> suicide bombers' families after the Israelis had destroyed the family home? Or do you mean fighting us when we appeared on his borders?

Sev
02-26-2012, 09:08 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So we didn't actually bomb and invade Pakistan nor bomb and invade Libya? </div></div>

We bombed Libya, and drone-attacked in Pakistan, invading neither, of course. </div></div>

Leading from behind in an attempt to keep his hands clean.

The mans a coward.

The question coming up is what will be more politically expedient for reelection. Bombing Iran or Blaming Israel if they do it first.

Soflasnapper
02-27-2012, 12:47 AM
A coward who's doubled the drone attack killings, ordered pirates killed on multiple occasions, inserted special forces into a sovereign country without permission to take out OBL, admittedly killed several US citizens without so much as declaring them enemy combatants, and escalated in Afghanistan by 30,000 troops or whatever?

No clean hands, and no hiding that record. Not much cowardice either.

Soflasnapper
02-27-2012, 12:53 AM
What else was there, supposedly?

He did fire, ineffectually, at the British/American joint air cap flown over his northern Kurdish area. But that had no legal basis, and was simply a violation of his sovereign air space, for which he had a perfect right of defense.

Even Bush realized this, and so had suggested that a true casus belli be created, by repainting a US Air Force heavy aircraft in UN colors, flying it low to be hit, and then using that excuse to say hostilities had commenced. Even he did not say that the Iraqis firing at the air cap planes was a cause for war.

LWW
02-27-2012, 07:00 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So we didn't actually bomb and invade Pakistan nor bomb and invade Libya? </div></div>

We bombed Libya, and drone-attacked in Pakistan, invading neither, of course. </div></div>

So we never put a Seal team in Osama's compound nor boots in Libya.

You were denial well.

LWW
02-27-2012, 07:01 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bush was proud to proclaim his doctrine of preventative war, and then engaged in one, in Iraq. </div></div>

Are you seriously denying that Saddam repeatedly committed acts of war against the US? </div></div>

Are you seriously claiming he did?</div></div>

Beyond any shadow of a doubt.

Soflasnapper
02-27-2012, 12:08 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So we didn't actually bomb and invade Pakistan nor bomb and invade Libya? </div></div>

We bombed Libya, and drone-attacked in Pakistan, invading neither, of course. </div></div>

So we never put a Seal team in Osama's compound nor boots in Libya.

You were [sic] denial well. </div></div>

You WEAR myopia well, as some 8 hours before this reply, I said [President Obama] inserted special forces into a sovereign country without permission to take out OBL. WHERE did I say that? Look up, my blinded friend!

A lightning strike, in and out in hours, is not an invasion. Having secreted some spies or special forces spotters into a country is also not an invasion, or else Iran has been invaded already by the US and Israel. That isn't what is meant by the term invasion, whatever straining you quixotically perform to try to force words to your preferred meanings.

Soflasnapper
02-27-2012, 12:09 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LWW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bush was proud to proclaim his doctrine of preventative war, and then engaged in one, in Iraq. </div></div>

Are you seriously denying that Saddam repeatedly committed acts of war against the US? </div></div>

Are you seriously claiming he did?</div></div>

Beyond any shadow of a doubt. </div></div>

Name ONE such act, and then name a second.

LWW
02-27-2012, 12:40 PM
- The hijacking of the Achille Lauro.

- The murder of Leon Klinghofer.

- The attempted murder of Bush the Elder.

- Countless firings at US planes.

- Hiding Abu Abbas and allowing him to live on a diplomatic pension.

- Paying the families of homicide bombers between $10K and $25K to have their children murder innocents, including Americans.

Soflasnapper
02-27-2012, 01:53 PM
Iraq didn't sponsor Abu Abbas. I've never heard that claim, ever. He was allegedly working for the PLO, as I recall. However, former Mossad asset Victor Oestrovsky wrote in his book By Way of Deception (the motto of the Mossad: by deception, you shall make war) that it was Israel who hired him as a false flag actor.

This makes some sense, as Israel left Abu Abbas live openly unmolested in the West Bank for years after these events, none of their famous 'never again' reprisals, although he was easily targeted, as they killed several heads of Hamas over the years.

Already covered his shooting at planes (perfect right to defend his airspace sovereignty, and nobody honest says differently, even W himself realizing it wasn't a cause for war), and his funding of the dead bombers living relatives after they were killed was ex post facto, not prospective. The Israelis application of illegal group punishment, ala the Nazis, saw them routinely bulldozing not just the family's home, but often the entire square block in which the house sat. This was humanitarian aid.

LWW
02-27-2012, 02:52 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Soflasnapper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Iraq didn't sponsor Abu Abbas. I've never heard that claim, ever. He was allegedly working for the PLO, as I recall. However, former Mossad asset Victor Oestrovsky wrote in his book By Way of Deception (the motto of the Mossad: by deception, you shall make war) that it was Israel who hired him as a false flag actor.

This makes some sense, as Israel left Abu Abbas live openly unmolested in the West Bank for years after these events, none of their famous 'never again' reprisals, although he was easily targeted, as they killed several heads of Hamas over the years.</div></div>

Shame on you.

http://www.mefacts.com/cache/html/incitement/11630_files/34.jpg http://www.mefacts.com/cache/html/incitement/11630_files/35sized.jpg

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In addition to funds, Saddam Hussein's government provided diplomatic help to Islamic extremists. This is Abu Abbas, former secretary general of the Palestine Liberation Front. He masterminded the October 7-9, 1985 hijacking of an Italian cruise ship whose name, sadly, is now synonymous with terrorism. The Achille Lauro was on a voyage across the Mediterranean when four Palestinian terrorists seized it on the high seas. They held some 400 passengers hostage for 44 hours.

At one point, they segregated the Jewish passengers on board. One of them was a 69-year-old New York retiree named Leon Klinghoffer. He happened to be confined to a wheelchair. Without mercy, Abu Abbas’ men shot Klinghoffer, then rolled him, wheelchair and all, into the Mediterranean.

The hijackers surrendered to Egyptian authorities in exchange for safe passage to Tunisia. Abu Abbas then joined them on a flight to freedom aboard an Egypt Air jet. However, four U.S. fighter planes forced the airliner to land at a NATO base in Sicily. Italian officials took the hijackers into custody. But Abbas possessed the ultimate get-out-of-jail card: An Iraqi diplomatic passport.

How do we know this?

The source for this information is not Ann Coulter or Rush Limbaugh. It is none other than this man, Bettino Craxi. At that time, he was Italy’s prime minister. As Craxi explained in an October 14, 1985 UPI story: “Abu Abbas was the holder of an Iraqi diplomatic passport…The plane was on an official mission, considered covered by diplomatic immunity and extra-territorial status in the air and on the ground.” </div></div>

What kind of warped mind will excuse terrorist thugs and then blame the victims ... all for the simple cause of hyper-partisan games? (http://www.mefacts.com/outgoing.asp?x_id=11630)

Soflasnapper
02-28-2012, 10:55 AM
Craxi was an Arab-sympathizing socialist, who had made common cause with those persons over his career. As there is no mention made of the supposed diplomatic immunity in these review articles, perhaps he made up this story as an alibi?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In the international arena, he helped dissidents and Socialist Parties throughout the world organise and become independent. Notable recipients of his logistical help were the Spanish Socialist Workers' Party (PSOE) during Francisco Franco's dictatorship, and dramatist Jiři Pelikan, in the then Czechoslovakia. A rare footage of Craxi trying to lay flowers at the tomb of Salvador Allende has been unearthed from RAI's (Radiotelevisione Italiana) archives. There is also proof that part of Craxi's illegally earned money was given in secret to leftist political opposition in Uruguay during the military dictatorship, to Solidarity in the period of Jaruzelski rule in Poland, and to Yasser Arafat and his Palestine Liberation Organization because of Craxi's sympathy for the Palestinian cause.

According to Giulio Andreotti (the 42nd Prime Minister of Italy) and Abdel Rahman Shalgham (Libya's Foreign Minister from 2000 until 2009), Craxi was the person who phoned Muammar al-Gaddafi to warn him of the impending Operation El Dorado Canyon air-strikes against Libya on April 15, 1986, permitting Gaddafi and his family to evacuate their residence in the Bab al-Azizia compound moments before the bombs dropped.[1] He later played a role in the 1987 seizure of power in Tunisia by Zine el Abidine Ben Ali.
[edit] The Sigonella crisis

Internationally, Craxi is perhaps best remembered for an incident in October 1985, when he refused the request of US President Ronald Reagan to extradite the hijackers of the cruise ship Achille Lauro. After protracted negotiations, the hijackers were given safe passage to Egypt by plane. Three United States Navy F-14's forced the plane down to the United States Naval Air Facility (NAF) of Sigonella. According the version of political circles in Washington, Craxi first gave the United States Forces permission to detain the terrorists, but he later reneged on the deal. He ordered Italian troops to surround the US Forces protecting the plane. This move was supposedly dictated both by security concerns about terrorists targeting Italy if the United States had had it their way, and by the Italian tradition of diplomacy with the Arab world. Craxi's decisive character may have been relevant in this resolution. Though the Americans demanded that the Italian authorities extradite Abu Abbas of the PLO, Craxi stood firm on the grounds that the crime had been perpetrated on Italian territory, on which the Italian Republic had sole jurisdiction. Craxi rejected the US extradition order and let Abu Abbas - chief of the hijackers, present on the plane - flee to Yugoslavia; the four hijackers were later found guilty, and sentenced to prison terms (in USA supposed to be relatively light, above all for the juvenile offender present between them) for hijacking and murder of an Jewish American citizen, Leon Klinghoffer. Also Abbas was later convicted in Italy in absentia, and eventually died, officially from natural cause, shortly after being taken prisoner by American forces in the aftermath of the 2003 invasion of Iraq. This episode earned Craxi an article in The Economist titled "Europe's strong man" and a standing ovation in the Italian Senate, which included his communist opponents. </div></div>

His career ended in disgrace, as he became the most hated man in Italy, fleeing the law to refuge in Tunisia instead of facing his 24 year sentence. But as he tipped off Khadaffi, by these reports, he was apparently simply on the side of Arab terrorists in general.