View Full Version : Banking - What System do you use ?
Over the weekend i got my hands of two great Pool books
Precison Pool and Jeanette's Lee's book
Both mentioned the mirror system of Banking. I'm wondering how many of you use this system ? if you don't, what system do you use ?
9 Ball Girl
10-06-2002, 06:25 PM
I'll use the mirror system on bank shots that have a severe angle. But for the most of it, I can usually "see" it. The mirror system works pretty well as I've always pocketed the ball when I use that system.
I agree 100% with 9 Ball Girl. Most of the time it is intuitive, but for the tough ones the Mirror System works well and is really simple.
10-06-2002, 06:48 PM
Being mostly a 3 cushion billiard player i sometimes have to depend on my knowledge of that game with the diamond system. But i have also tried the mirror system and it works also very well. like 9 ball girl, i also just see them most times......................mike
10-06-2002, 07:14 PM
I don't know about all of that stuff.
I just use the ATM.
phil in sofla
10-06-2002, 10:19 PM
I used to use the 'x' system, which is a no-English system.
Now I use two different systems. One, which I use almost always, is to get a standard track line on the diamonds, such as the corner pocket to the second diamond to the side pocket, and then parallel it over, through the object ball (checking if another line is closer). Taking the closest standard line, and then parallelling it over, that is my contact point on the object ball, as hit with a little outside bottom English on the cue ball to induce a natural roll and a slight bit of running English on the object ball, to make it come off the rail on a more true line. If I can't or don't want to use draw, I'll use a little top outside English.
The other system is a one-pocket banking system, useful if the object ball is within a diamond of one of the rails. Anywhere from one diamond off the rail to closer than that, I aim the ball directly into the rail, but use 1-1/2 to 2 tips of English so that the ball 'turn's off the rail, and then banks back to the pocket opposite.
>What banking system do you use ?
B.O.A. Bank Of America (and my opponents are glad that I do)
I can believe Jeanette Lee's book is good, but "Precision Pool"? Have you really bothered to read it cover to cover or just poked around like I do when I first pick up a book? That thing has more mistakes in it than a dog has fleas, and they seem to multiply like fleas with each careful reading.
If you want some really useful info on banks, I'd look into Jack Koehler's "The Science of Pocket Billiards" and Russ Matthews "Million Dollar Bank." The latter, unfortunately, is out of print. "Million Dollar Bank" has some great tips but isn't much for illustrations, but neither is "Precision Pool" once you realize how many of the illustrations are nothing but confusing, inexact, three-dimensional eye candy.
A book I heard was pretty good but not well written is "Win at Pocket Billiards: Bank and Kick Shots Simplified, Explained and Illustrated." Maybe another respondent can say whether this book is much good. The reviews on Amazon are mixed.
Anyway, as far as one-rail banking, I like what Phil from South Florida had to say, probably because I use something similar that I learned from Koehler's book. Of course, the other respondents are correct too; it is a matter of feel, particularly when you're talking about the speed and the english you put on the cueball to affect the object ball. Too hard and the object ball slides and sinks into the cushion and is thrown short. Too easy and it can go a bit long from the natural forward roll of the object ball, although I seem not to notice this effect much with Simonis cloth.
Like Phil said, use varying degrees of outside english to give the object ball a more true line off the cushion. On the other hand, if you really have to shorten up the bank, you may have to use a hard stroke plus inside english. Personally, I like Robert Byrne's not so secret system for banking: practice, practice, practice.
On the mirror system, I think it's better for some banks and not as good for others, but generally I like other systems I found in Koehler's book better. Don't get me wrong; if it works for you on most banks, that's what counts. It's probably why there are so many systems.
On two and three rail banks, there are some 3-cushion books like the "Billiard Atlas for Systems and Techniques, Volume I - IV" you may want to look into as you become more proficient. However, the diamond system in "Byrne's New Standard Book of Pool and Billiards" should be learned and practiced first, particularly if you're adding kicking to your banking skills.
Just a note from my own experiences. For years it was luck when I made a bank, whether I was crossing the object ball or shooting outside the angle; I was happy to make one in ten banks. I didn't understand the collision induced english I was putting on the object ball. That all changed when I read one instructional article by Mike Sigel in the October 1989 issue of Billiards Digest. Like you with the mirror system, it was a revelation, a Godsend. It improved my banking 1000%; I kid you not.
10-07-2002, 01:07 AM
Yeah, I have to agree that Precision Pool is not "great." It was the first pool book I read. I was able to overlook most of its errors, like the poorly-worded sentences, because I just got what the authors were saying intuitively. And the poor diagrams or poorly explained diagrams...well I just kinda reasoned out what they were saying and saw where they were obviously wrong (after a few turns at the pool table). Like most pool books, you have to accept that not everything is biblical fact. Your gripe with PP is justified, because pool books (especially by knowledgeable authors) should be providing some fairly tried-and-true instruction.
The thing I liked about Lee's book is that she admits what most other author's don't: her book will not allow you to "master" pool, but it provides some insights into the game.
I've tried the X banking system, but its a little off for me. The mirror system makes sense, but it throws me off when trying to visualize the shot being made. Mainly I bank intuitively.
I use Miami Voodoo Daddy's painless, no english banking system. If I have to use English I just guess or as some people like to say "feel".
A few months ago one of the younger guys in my pool room I help asked me what aiming system I use. I told him I use "The Guess System". Needless to say, he was confused. Heck, I'm confused.
Kato~~~doesn't believe in aiming systems, mostly because I don't understand them.
When practicing banks, I just try to use center cue ball and the same speed for every shot. This can help with your banking game and one pocket as well. Don't really rely on the mirror or diamond systems too much because every table will play different, and if you take into account other factors like humidity, etc., this will also make banks challenging. I love bank pool, and when I'm ready to play, I try to use center ball banks first, then later, will use english on my shots with a moderate speed and a smooth and complete follow through.
10-07-2002, 11:42 AM
I use the, "double the distance" method as much as possible, otherwise; it is just "I just feel it" method and it misses.
I use the K.I.S.S. system (keeep it simple s.....). Which is advocated by some good instructors. First do drills that teach you to reconize a dead bank at medium speed with no sidespin. Then work on learning how to recognize a bank that requires a soft speed to extend the angle off the rail. Then work on drills that require a hard speed to shorten the angle off the rail. None of these shots should require you to have to cut the object ball into the rail.All of these are shot straight into the rail with centerball only. Forget all that english crap. You only need sidespin under extreme circumstances to distort the angle off the rail and it adds an unnecessary variable to most common banking situations. Once you learn to recognize which ball speed is required, most banks can be made with center ball only and your accuracy and consistency is increased because you don't have to deal with deflection and swerve.
I use more than one system. Depends how I feel. Sometimes I will use one system and check it by lining up the shot with another system. /s/ Rhymes with chile
phil in sofla
10-07-2002, 07:43 PM
"A book I heard was pretty good but not well written is "Win at Pocket Billiards: Bank and Kick Shots Simplified, Explained and Illustrated."
Not a bad book, if it were only closer to being true!!
I've read others complaining, and it was also my experience, that many of the lines the author suggests work simply do not work, at least given the tables I've tried them on, and with my stroke.
Koehler's book is comprehensive as to banks (and most other topics), so if you want to know, oh, 9 banking methods, that's a good source.
I learned to use draw for most bank shots from a Grady Matthews tape, wherein he says 'the most natural way to make a bank is to use a little draw,' as he proceeds to bank out an entire table to demonstrate the point.
I find the mirror system more useful for kicking than for banking, unless the table distance to the next table is about a table's width, in which case you can use that adjoining table's pockets for aim points for widthwise banks. If you're ever playing with tables too close together (about 4- 1/2 feet between them), then the mirror (table) system is a no-brainer that is highly recommended to simplify the aim points.
banks should be learned by finding the "dead" bank, shoot it with no english and stop the q in its tracks. when you make this shot you will know how to see where the object ball must contact the rail to bank to the pocket. This must be done in many locations and you must remember the places where the ball must be hit.
i know where the ball must contact to make it and that is the place i shoot to hit and if ive done my homework right the ball banks towards the pocket.
you must know that location for confidence and success
of course variables come into play, but the first shot must be the the "dead" shot with no q ball movement after, because this shows you hit the ball properly, and reinforcement is important to give one confidence in banking balls
shoot the shot, shoot the shot, shoot the shot, there is no replacement for the actual table time.
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