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View Full Version : Yay! THEY FINALLY CAUGHT THE POOPSTAIN!! (NPR)



10-24-2002, 12:38 PM
Damn, it's about time they caught that sniper idiot. Er.. at least are pretty sure they caught him..

10-24-2002, 01:35 PM
If so, good news for the NEWT and CAT girls! Both have tournaments scheduled in MD. come November.

10-24-2002, 01:37 PM
I hope it's really the guy(s) and not some sucker that has been setup to ease public pressure.

Kato
10-24-2002, 02:07 PM
With the Ka-Bar and that neck stack thingy you know about.

Kato~~~knows stuff Wes knows.

MikeM
10-24-2002, 03:51 PM
Oh great, an anonymous conspiracy theorist shows up! Let us wnjoy a felling of relief for a few hours at least.

MM

10-24-2002, 04:08 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Anonymous:</font><hr> I hope it's really the guy(s) and not some sucker that has been setup to ease public pressure. <hr></blockquote>

It should be pretty obvious if noone gets shot in the next week or so, that they found the guy... however, I still would be hiding behind my car to fill up gas if I lived in that area. /ccboard/images/icons/smile.gif

WesK
10-24-2002, 04:09 PM
Well, I was going to say that they are innocent until proven guilty and all that but...

I just heard over the radio that their gun is a match. We have to see if this is true or not.

Now we have to draw out the long trip through the courts...

If these are the guys, well, they just can't reach room temperature soon enough.

wes

10-24-2002, 04:22 PM
Where is the white van and why were we told to be on the look-out for a maroon and blue Caprice. I dont see any maroon on that car.

3 weeks to catch these bumblers?

Kato
10-24-2002, 08:30 PM
Jeez Wes, they aren't gonna let you do that thing with the stack and the spine? Well what are you supposed to do with all that training we spent all those tax dollars on?

Kato~~~fry 'em

Harold Acosta
10-25-2002, 01:05 AM
With the following info, it is pretty sure that they got the sniper. Apparently the guy was an "expert marksmanship" a category which is under the "Army Sniper."

(AP) - One of America's most extraordinary manhunts culminated Thursday in the arrests of an Army veteran and a teenager, asleep at a roadside rest stop perpetrators, authorities believe, of a bloody, three-week sniping spree that left 10 people dead and multitudes paralyzed by fear. John Allen Muhammad, 41, arrested with John Lee Malvo, 17 appeared in court, and was ordered held without bail. A gun found in the suspects' car a Bushmaster AR-15 rifle had been linked by ballistics to 11 of the 14 shootings.

Lester
10-25-2002, 06:14 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Harold Acosta:</font><hr> With the following info, it is pretty sure that they got the sniper. Apparently the guy was an "expert marksmanship" a category which is under the "Army Sniper
(AP) - One of America's most extraordinary manhunts culminated Thursday in the arrests of an Army veteran and a teenager, asleep at a roadside rest stop perpetrators, authorities believe, of a bloody, three-week sniping spree that left 10 people dead and multitudes paralyzed by fear. John Allen Muhammad, 41, arrested with John Lee Malvo, 17 appeared in court, and was ordered held without bail. A gun found in the suspects' car a Bushmaster AR-15 rifle had been linked by ballistics to 11 of the 14 shootings.

<hr></blockquote>."&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Harold, let's not give this guy too much credit. His accuracy was based on laying in his car, shooting through a hole he had drilled in the trunk. His victims were very close. His later shootings (not from the car) were no more than 130 FEET. You can ask WesK but in order to qualify (rifle) in the USMC (where everyone must be a rifleman) you had to hit the target from 500 yards with an open sight. (without a scope) That's 1500 FEET. This guy was NOT a sniper. He was a "nut-case", that I would gladly drop the hammer on. JMHO ***Lester~sorry,I didn't realize how "emotionally charged" I was about this.

Jay M
10-25-2002, 06:37 AM
Just to add a bit to the qualification part. In the Army, qualification for "Expert Marksman" (as of the early 90's) involved hitting 36 out of 40 pop up targets at varying ranges fron 50 meters to 600 meters OR hitting 36 of 40 paper targets at 50 meters (with the targets scaled in size to mimic shooting at a longer range. In all of the units that I was attached to, just about everyone was an "Expert Marksman" with the rifle. Most of the ranges weren't automated, the scoring was done by either themselves (rarely) or their friend. To be an "Expert Marksman" in the Army is NOT a step below sniper. An expert marksman is about 10 steps below a sniper. Sniper qualification (for marksmanship) was 36 out of 40 hits at ranges from 300 yards to 1100 yards with an instructor acting as your spotter. The instructor didn't call the wind for you so you had to make your own adjustments based on your first round fired at that target.

In our class, we started with over 80 people, 6 of us graduated. There's a HUGE difference between the two levels of marksmanship.

Jay M&lt;~~~ Graduate of the US Army Sniper School, Camp Casey Korea

Gayle in MD
10-25-2002, 06:40 AM
THANK GOD! This has been a terrible ordeal for those of us who live in Md. The worst part of it was that it went on and on. When you think how hard it is to catch someone who is operating as a sniper, helter skelter, it is amazing that they got him (Them)so fast, and definately shows the tremendous value in great police investigation work! My hat goes off to the police departments involved, their ability to work together to get these two, and their tireless efforts. Congratulations to them, one and all, and a big "Thank you" to the wonderful man who saw something that didn't quite look right, and called 911. I only wish that the Montgomery County Chief had acknowledged HIM last night in his press conference, along with the officials. I sure wish, though, that the news channels wouldn't say some of the things that they say in the middle of these awful nightmares. They seem to give out information at times which would be better left unsaid. Channel nine, here in Washington, last evening, did a long segway on the bullet! Harping and harping on the way it blew apart, and holding it up like an award or something, throughout. I don't even want to say much about it HERE! I do think a lot of those type statements should be left out. Sometimes, you almost get the feeling they are giving other nuts good info on how to do it right! Thank God they are off the street, and we can all go back to living our lives in peace! My heart goes out to all those who lost loved ones in this terrible ordeal.
Gayle in Md, been ducking and zig-zagging for weeks!

Lester
10-25-2002, 06:46 AM
Thanks for the clarification Jay. We used to call the Army's marksmanship program "The spray and pray method". However, we never said that about Army Snipers --CAUSE THEY COULD SHOOT! ***Lester~would like to play a 9-ball tournament in my "gilly-suit".

Lester
10-25-2002, 06:53 AM
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Gayle, I agree with you that some of the reporting on this has been reprehensible. The TV networks motto is "If it Bleeds, it Leads". Some of the former "Profilers" they had on, didn't have a bleeping clue. I guess that's why they are "former" profilers. ***Lester***

Jay M
10-25-2002, 07:09 AM
ROFL

Spray and Pray is pretty much the way that the army approached marksmanship until the M-16A2 which only allows 3 round bursts unless modified. A factoid for you. During the Vietnam War, there was something like 10,000 rounds of ammunition fired for every enemy kill. I forget the actual number, but it was something outrageous like that. Comparably, Carlos Hathcock, the Marine Sniper that the movie "Sniper" was about, fired a total of about 400 rounds during the war and compiled 93 confirmed kills and 112 (113?) unconfirmed kills. That's somewhere around 2 bullets for every kill. That's what military marksmanship is all about!

We had a lot of respect for the Marine snipers as well. During our school cycle, a group of Marine snipers that were training happened to need the same range as us and we had a little friendly competition. The 8 of us that were left at that point were using M-21's and the Marines had the brand new M-24's. It was really close, but they outshot us by an average of one hit per man (out of 10 rounds at 1300 yards)

Jay M

10-25-2002, 07:24 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Gayle in MD:</font><hr> THANK GOD! This has been a terrible ordeal for those of us who live in Md. The worst part of it was that it went on and on. When you think how hard it is to catch someone who is operating as a sniper, helter skelter, it is amazing that they got him (Them)so fast, and definately shows the tremendous value in great police investigation work! My hat goes off to the police departments involved, their ability to work together to get these two, and their tireless efforts. Congratulations to them, one and all, and a big "Thank you" to the wonderful man who saw something that didn't quite look right, and called 911. I only wish that the Montgomery County Chief had acknowledged HIM last night in his press conference, along with the officials. I sure wish, though, that the news channels wouldn't say some of the things that they say in the middle of these awful nightmares. They seem to give out information at times which would be better left unsaid. Channel nine, here in Washington, last evening, did a long segway on the bullet! Harping and harping on the way it blew apart, and holding it up like an award or something, throughout. I don't even want to say much about it HERE! I do think a lot of those type statements should be left out. Sometimes, you almost get the feeling they are giving other nuts good info on how to do it right! Thank God they are off the street, and we can all go back to living our lives in peace! My heart goes out to all those who lost loved ones in this terrible ordeal.
Gayle in Md, been ducking and zig-zagging for weeks!
<hr></blockquote>

I agree, Gayle! And I forgot you lived in that area.. that must have been really wierd and scary. I started watching behind my back occasionally, and I live in Washington!! (of course, I guess they are from tacoma, which is only about 60 miles from me).

anyways, they got the pieces of crap, and hopefully we don't have to spend too many tax dollars feeding their worthless a$$es, and we can just burn the crap out of 'em. I don't have much sypmathy for senseless killing of innocent people.. or ANY people for that matter.

Anyways, thank God for attentive citizens and police in that area.

Lester
10-25-2002, 08:00 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Jay M:</font><hr> Comparably, Carlos Hathcock, the Marine Sniper that the movie "Sniper" was about, fired a total of about 400 rounds during the war and compiled 93 confirmed kills and 112 (113?) unconfirmed kills.

Jay M <hr></blockquote>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Well, you know your stuff Jay. Carlos was the only sniper that the North Vietnamese put a "bounty" on. I think he lost 2 or 3 spotters because of it. And of course, there was his famous 1780 yard shot with a 50 calibre, using a scope duct taped on. BTW, that explains why you shoot pool so well, it's much the same approach, with alot of the same discipline. ***Lester***

Wally_in_Cincy
10-25-2002, 11:34 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote: Gayle in MD:</font><hr> Congratulations to them, one and all, and a big "Thank you" to the wonderful man who saw something that didn't quite look right, and called 911. I only wish that the Montgomery County Chief had acknowledged HIM last night in his press conference, along with the officials.
<hr></blockquote>

Ron Lantz of Ludlow KY made the 911 call. He's a truck driver who was listening to "The Truckin' Bozo" (all-night DJ) on 700 WLW in Cincinnati. Bozo put the word on to thousands of truckers to be on the lookout. Lantz and another driver blocked the rest area exit with their bigrigs till the cops got there. Lantz says if he gets a reward he's gonna give it to the victims' families. Gotta love them Kentucky fellers.

Vicki
10-26-2002, 12:37 AM
Hi Lorri,

It is a huge relief that they caught this guy. I live about 10 minutes from police headquarters in Rockville and play at the Champion Billiards there. My office window overlooks the Shell parking lot where the lady was killed vacuuming her car. That was my post office that the lady on the bench was killed in front of and I used to get gas at the Mobil where the cab driver was killed. The last victim, the bus driver, was killed in front of my mother's house. To say I am relieved is an understatement if ever there was one. I got to the point that I worked from home, kept my daughter home from school, and let my car sit in the driveway on empty. My poor dog hadn't been for walk in 3 weeks - she's relieved too, literally. Hooray for our police... I was moved to tears when Chief Moose made the announcement. I know it sounds corney, but, I am proud to be a resident of Montgomery County.

Will I see you in November at Champion's?

Vicki