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02-26-2003, 08:32 AM
If I have ball in hand - and I am walking around the table, surveying it - with the cue ball in my hand - and I drop the cueball on the floor - does my opponent get ball in hand?

Chris

9 Ball Girl
02-26-2003, 09:07 AM
I don't think so. It's not like you dropped it on the table and moved a few balls around. I'm not sure though.

ChrisW
02-26-2003, 09:08 AM
No, he doesn't.
But I think there is a loose ball foul where both players get to scramble for the ball and the player that comes up with it gets to keep the game ball and a new cue ball with be used for the rest of the game.

Seriously, the only way dropping the cue ball would be a foul is if it hits another ball on the table.

Chris

cycopath
02-26-2003, 11:59 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote ChrisW:</font><hr>But I think there is a loose ball foul where both players get to scramble for the ball and the player that comes up with it gets to keep the game ball and a new cue ball with be used for the rest of the game.<hr /></blockquote>ROFLMAO!

breaknrun1
02-26-2003, 12:15 PM
It is most definately a foul. See rule 9(i) of eightball rules. The cue ball is always live so if you accidently drop it on the floor, in a pocket, or hit another ball with it, it is a foul. BTW, a player on my team had ball in hand and he likes to roll the cue ball around before he decides what direction to take and lost control of it and it went into the side pocket giving his opponent ball in hand on the eightball !!!

ChrisW
02-26-2003, 01:15 PM
I just cut this from the APA 8&amp;9 rule (website)
After reading this again I still think it is not a foul to drop the cue ball.
Also note the line "A foul may be called only if the player fouls while actually stroking the cue ball"

Chris


APA rule 9(j):
Use caution when picking up or placing the cue
ball in a ball-in-hand situation. The cue ball is
always alive. If the cue ball, or the hand holding it
or moving it, touches another ball it is a cue ball
foul and your opponent has ball-in-hand. Be
especially careful when picking up or placing the
cue ball in a tight spot.


9. Fouls - If any of the following fouls are committed,
the penalty is ball-in-hand for the incoming player.
Make certain you have ball-in-hand before you touch the
cue ball by confirming with your opponent. Ball-in-hand
means you are allowed to place the cue ball anywhere
on the table (with the exception of fouls on the break
which result in ball-in-hand behind the head string) and
shoot any of your balls (or the 8, if all of your category
of balls have been pocketed). Even after having
addressed the cue ball, a player may, if not satisfied
with the placement, make further adjustments with the
hand, cue stick or any other reasonable piece of
equipment. A foul may be called only if the player fouls
while actually stroking the cue ball, meaning a double hit
of the cue ball (sometimes called double clutching). The
ball-in-hand rule penalizes a player for an error. Without
this rule, a player could benefit by accidentally or
purposely scratching or otherwise fouling.

02-26-2003, 01:25 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote breaknrun1:</font><hr> It is most definately a foul. See rule 9(i) of eightball rules. The cue ball is always live so if you accidently drop it on the floor, in a pocket, or hit another ball with it, it is a foul. BTW, a player on my team had ball in hand and he likes to roll the cue ball around before he decides what direction to take and lost control of it and it went into the side pocket giving his opponent ball in hand on the eightball !!! <hr /></blockquote>I think you're mistaken. Nowhere in APA, BCA, or WPA rules does it state that dropping the cueball during BIH is a foul unless it contacts another object ball. The 9(i) and 9(j) paragraphs you quote are assumed to be from the APA rulebook, and are as follows:[ QUOTE ]
i. The player or his coach (during a coaching timeout) may place the cue ball in a ball-in-hand situation. The same rule regarding placing the cue ball applies to the coach as applies to the player. If the player, or coach fouls in the process of placing the cue ball, it will be ball-in-hand for the opponent. Therefore, it should be the player's choice if he wishes to place the cue ball or allow his coach to do so.
j. Use caution when picking up or placing the cue ball in a ball-in-hand situation. The cue ball is always alive. If the cue ball, or the hand holding it or moving it, touches another ball it is a cue ball foul and your opponent has ball-in-hand. Be especially careful when picking up or placing the cue ball in a tight spot.<hr /></blockquote>
All this talks about are fouls made by touching other object balls while placing the CB during BIH. I have never, ever heard of a foul being called by accidently dropping the CB, whether on the table, in a pocket, or elsewhere, unless contact with an object ball was also made.

David

Edit: Sorry, ChrisW beat me to it! /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif That'll teach me to start a reply and then walk away for 10 minutes...

breaknrun1
02-26-2003, 02:31 PM
David,
You may be right. I was just reading into the statement, "The cue ball is always live." I'm pretty sure it is a foul if you drop the cue ball into a pocket but sounds rediculous to call a foul if you drop it on the floor

02-26-2003, 03:36 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote breaknrun1:</font><hr> David,
You may be right. I was just reading into the statement, "The cue ball is always live." I'm pretty sure it is a foul if you drop the cue ball into a pocket but sounds rediculous to call a foul if you drop it on the floor <hr /></blockquote>

generally, there is a principal in law that, if the literal interpretation of the written word gives a silly result then it's wrong. as i read pool rules, they are all trying to deal with something that effects, or may effect the game. dropping a ball in a hole has no effect and calling that a foul is a silly effect in my opinion.

it's kinda like the people who yell foul when you lay your cue on the table. "gotcha"! not really. read it. it talks about using it as an aiming device.

although it may not seem like it some times, the people who write the rules are trying to make it more fair and get us out of confusing stuff that happens, not make it silly.

no offense to you, just my opinion of rule writing.

dan