View Full Version : Gambling Ethics Question
Chris in NC
03-01-2003, 08:08 PM
A road player who comes in our room and sees a few regulars (obviously decent players) playing a set against each other. He inquires as to any action available. It is already after midnight (normal closing hours), but I agree to stay open and he agrees with one of the regulars on a race to 7 for $50. Both players appear evenly matched and it ends up going hill-hill, with the regular prevailing. The road player then says he's down to his last $25 and wants to play another set for $25. The regular declines the action, telling the roadie that he can forget it, but that he's welcome to come back the next day with a substantial amount of $ if he wants a rematch. The roadie gets very upset accusing the regular of quitting ahead, etc., etc. He becomes quite beligerent, but is escorted out the door by a few of us.
My feeling was that the regular had every right to quit and had absolutely no obligation to decrease the bet to $25 to play another set, particularly knowing that his opponent was down to his last $25. Why should he risk everything he had in his pocket (possibly hundreds) just for another measley $25.
IMO, the roadie should have either played shorter sets for $25, giving him a possible 3 set cushion until he would have been forced to quit, or just have played one set for $75 and quit if he lost the first one, but certainly not revealing to his opponent that he was broke. It would anger me to think that a player was trying to bust me for possibly many $ hundreds, but only risking $50 or $75 of their own money.
This is a valuable lesson that perhaps both players (when unknown to each other) should have to show they have some cash and commit to posting up a certain amount before either one is allowed to pull out. What do others think is appropriate under these circumstances? - Chris in NC
Chris, I'm not a gambler but I think the player that won has every right to pull up if he wants. He offered a rematch the following day to the roadie and gave him a chance to get his money back and/or win a substantial amount. That sounds fair to me. The concept of never quitting while your ahead just doesn't make any sense to me.
I have trouble believing that a true roadie would be on the road with only $75... Me thinks something's not on the up-'n-up.
Troy...~~~Believes Chris' story tho...
Quitting ahead in pool is looked down upon more than other forms of gambling. But anybody can pull up at anytime and it should not be the cause of a big argument. And in this case a "road player" wants action for only his last $25? I can't believe he's a road player. Hell, he can't even pay time. Screw him. Even if they played again, the most the regular should do is lose back 25. He should never give the "road player" a shot at 50 for 25.
As I said to some idiot in a public poker game (no expectation that players will give anybody a chance at their money back) who complained that I was leaving with his money when I was quitting, "No, I'm leaving with MY money." /ccboard/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
03-01-2003, 08:53 PM
Good to see you posting again.. I missed your posts..
Ethical question.. absolutely.. the road player didn't have any at all.. your player was well within ethics.. knowing the bum only had $25 sealed the deal..
03-01-2003, 09:02 PM
JPB, you gave him the right answer. You quit when you want, never let anyone dictate when you should quit.
I been a Dealer in casinos for the last 22 years and i hear time and time again from players when they are up and losing it back : "Its ok, its the houses money"
DEAD WRONG. Its in your posession, its yours, period.
03-01-2003, 09:56 PM
That is why they call it gambling. Either player can do whatever they want, whenever they want, depending what they have discussed. Play, quit whatever. That's is the way it goes. No big deal, no guarantees. There are no means to make another player do what you want, just don't play him again if you don't like his action. I have a long list of them and it has nothing to do with whether I have the best of it or not. Some players I just don't play.
03-02-2003, 02:47 AM
Chris...You were absolutely right! Great to see you back here...been a long time! I was just talking with Ralph S. and Rhino Chaser yesterday and today, and we all mentioned, in talking about the CCB, that we all miss your participation. I told them I was gonna look you up in VF, and ask you to come back! You beat me to it! Welcome!
03-02-2003, 05:27 AM
Chris, Since you say that several of your frends escorted him out of your pool room it sounds like he beat you out of table time. Jake
03-02-2003, 06:35 AM
the roadie sounds like an idiot. i think with pool more than other forms of gambling it is looked down upon to quit while ahead, because the loser might have been tryiong to hustle. so to get more$$$$$$action, he'll pull up and your buddy took his legs out(all $50 of it /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif) by quiting.
They started out playing after hours and agreed to one set. There was no right to expect a second set and certainly should be no charge of quitting while ahead. I see no way that the roadie should have expected an all night session just because he could not win the first set and make a quick $50.
The fact that he could not cover a second set was even more reason not to have one. At any rate, neither you nor the regular should be expected to stay up all night to accomodate the roadie even if he had more money. The offer to play the next day if he had enough money to make it worthwhile was reasonable and generous.
03-02-2003, 12:26 PM
I think the roadie should've just bet $65 in the first place. The regular was right to quit when he did especially since the roadie only had $25 left. I wouldn't continue playing myself if I was in the regular's position either.
I believe it's your choice when to stop/continue gambling not somebody elses. I'm glad you guys showed the roadie the door when he became upset, good for you.
03-02-2003, 12:40 PM
A road player with $75??? Whatever. Anyway, I spent many years out on the road and I can tell you that you can leave whenever you want. If I won your cash, there is no law or code of ethics that say I am obligated to give you any chance of winning it back. I was quite ruthless out there and would go for the jugular quickly, and count the cash in the car. $25 is nothing to get excited about anyway. It could be that the guy was setting your local guy up for someone else, or he was playing him off, and planning on coming out full speed in the next set. Who knows for sure? There is no shame in going home a winner. If I'm up a couple of hundred and I want to call off, I'm going to. I'm not really going to care what anyone thinks about it either. I'm not out there to help anyone else but myself. That might sound ruthless and heartless, but that's how it is out there. At this link
I give my own synopsis on gambling in pool rooms.
Chris in NC
03-02-2003, 01:30 PM
Troy, actually I'm guilty of misusing the term "road player" in my post. What I really meant by my use of the term "road player" in this instance is any highly skilled player (capable of stringing multiple racks) that is not from this area and who happens to come to our room to play - mainly looking for a money game. I understand that a true road player (like Tony Watson and Amar who have been in here) are players that strictly play pool for their livlihood - gambling and tournaments.
Since our room here is so far off the beaten path and not in a major metropolitan area, what we get more of in here other than the true road player is the occasional highly skilled player that is in the area as a tourist or doing some kind of business in the area, but has a very strong pool game and is looking for some action.
This particular player was actually with a larger group of gentleman, who left about the time he started his match but knew he was playing the match. What I found strange was that if he only had $75 cash on him, why he didn't borrow a few hundred from one of his buddies just in case he needed it. Obviously he didn't feel he would need it, as I guess he planned on winning the first set. Too bad! - Chris in NC
By the way Chris, what did think of Amar's game ??? I've known him for about 3-4 years, not a personal friend, but I know him.
If you can't quit ahead at some point... the best you can hope for is to leave with the same money you showed up with.
03-02-2003, 06:00 PM
Hi Chris, its great to see you back finally. I kinda attend to agree with the majority here on this thread.
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