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03-11-2003, 07:50 PM
You're playing a game of one-hole in a big tournament and you both need 1. The last ball is hung deep in your opponents pocket and your frozen to the opposite end rail. You tell the referee to come watch the hit, you then hit the cuball very softly (like those times when you acidentally touch your tip to the cueball on a practice stroke), then you hit it again into the hanger. So, either if you do follow in or not, what's the ref supposed to call? What about if you're gambling?

Deeman
03-12-2003, 08:31 AM
If someone did this to me, I might just take up bowling!

Dee

PQQLK9
03-12-2003, 01:03 PM
I would think that after the first hit you would owe a ball and lose your turn on the foul.The second hit borders on unsportsman/womanship weather it's tournament play or gambling.(Just my .02 cents worth.

smfsrca
03-12-2003, 01:40 PM
How about this.
The first stroke is legal and no contact is made so a ball will be owed.
The second or offending stroke is illegal and if any balls are moved as a result they can be restored as near as possible to there original location.
Now your apponent has ball in hand with a hanger for the win.
You have accomplished nothing in your attempt to be clever accept possibly making an enemy of your apponent.

03-12-2003, 02:48 PM
if you are gambling and someone does this and sinks the ball but doesnt follow it in you simply don't call the foul and you win the game

NH_Steve
03-12-2003, 08:55 PM
I like this answer /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Now I just gotta remember not to be too impulsive in calling the foul.

California Kid
03-12-2003, 09:47 PM
Since you are already on the rail, high cue ball will follow the ball in for a foul. Shoot real hard , make the ball and jump off the table. either way you have two balls on the spot and are still alive.

dddd
03-12-2003, 11:02 PM
this question seems somewhat answered in your question.
foul of course, and the failure to push thru keeping contact and folowing ball in with q or jumping q off table for two ball spot, leads to loss, only thing you did was drag it out.

California Kid
03-13-2003, 08:59 PM
One last time.If you foul and do not scratch or jump the cue ball off the table the ball stays down and you loose the match. If you knock the ball into the pocket and scratch or jump the cue ball off the table the ball goes on the spot and one of your balls goes on the spot. Now you are down 7-6 but you are still in the game. Cue ball fouls or double hits (whatever) the ball stays down and the game is over, foul or not.

HOWARD
03-14-2003, 02:22 PM
Enso,

First touch is a foul. 1. If he makes the ball and does not
scratch. Game is over. 2. If he makes the ball and does scratch the opponent is entitled to replace the object ball to close as he can to where it was and has ball in hand.
3. The player making this gaf - has no say as to where his opponent places the object ball.

Howard

Professor
03-15-2003, 07:22 PM
This is one of the oldest hustles used on players not familiar with the game of one-pocket. The rule as I was taught it was that it is the opponent's option as to whether or not the ball pocketed on a foul shot, which is not a scratch or cue ball jumped off the table, is spotted or stays down. Regardless of the option selected, it is a foul on the shooter, and they owe a ball. /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Now, in the situation you give, it is the game ball for the opponent, then obviously the opponent would select to keep the ball and win the game.

Reference the BCA One-Pocket Rules (http://www.bca-pool.com/play/tournaments/rules/rls_onepocket.shtml):
[ QUOTE ]
SCORING
A legally pocketed ball is scored as one ball for shooter. Any ball pocketed in opponent's target pocket counts, unless the cue ball should scratch on the same shot. If the shot constitutes a foul other than a scratch, the opponent is allowed to keep the ball. … <hr /></blockquote>Reference the Texas Express One-Pocket Rules (http://www.texasexpress.com./rules_onepocket.htm):
[ QUOTE ]
5. Scoring
A legally pocketed numbered ball is scored as one ball for the shooter. Any numbered ball pocketed in the opponent's pocket counts, unless the cue ball should scratch on the same shot. If the shot constitutes a foul other than a scratch, the opponent is allowed to keep the ball. ...<hr /></blockquote>This aspect of the rules was taught to me by the old time road player, Sonny Springer. He stressed that it was the opponent's option and told me that it would be tried on me. As he pointed out, there are cases (not where the hung ball is the opponent's game ball) in which you (if you are the opponent) would elect to have the ball spotted. The basic situation is where spotting the ball provids you with a shot on which you could pull shape to make additional balls. /ccboard/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

To be honest, I thought this would never happen, that someone would try to pull this on me. Well sure enough, it was by a prior World Champion One-Pocket player. He double hit the cue, said “Oh, I fouled”, then reached in my pocket to spot the ball. I simply looked at him, smiled, and told him what Sonny have instructed me to say, “That’s OK, I think I’ll keep that one." He simply smiled and reached for the rack. /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

You might question the part of the rule as I was taught it by Sonny Springer, in which it is the opponent's "option” as to whether or not the ball is spotted. While not explicitly stated in the rules, note it is implicit in the phrase “the opponent is allowed to keep the ball”, with the operative word being “allowed”.

I hope this helps,