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charlieb
04-02-2003, 11:31 PM
A local cue maker is selling a new cue that has spring type joint that hits really good with virtually no deflection. A friend bought one and told me that his draw improved dramatically. Another friend has hit with one, only 4 or 5 racks, and said he was probably going to buy one. They both described it to me as having a very, very small separation between the shaft and forearm. Anyone familiar with anything similiar? Are there any rules governing cue construction? Supposedly there is a patent pending.

Pizza Bob
04-03-2003, 07:23 AM
Don't quite know what you mean by a "spring-type" joint. But the gap between the forearm and the shaft rings a bell. Layani cues has a conical taper on the shaft half of the joint that goes into a female counterpart in the butt. Therefore it is self centering and it doesn't quite come all the way together - leaving a very slight gap. Theiry (sorry if I got the spelling wrong) posts here and can better comment on this. I also believe he may have patents pending. The people that are using his cues sing high praise of them.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

Fred Agnir
04-03-2003, 07:37 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote charlieb:</font><hr> A local cue maker is selling a new cue that has spring type joint that hits really good with virtually no deflection. A friend bought one and told me that his draw improved dramatically. Another friend has hit with one, only 4 or 5 racks, and said he was probably going to buy one. They both described it to me as having a very, very small separation between the shaft and forearm. Anyone familiar with anything similiar? Are there any rules governing cue construction? Supposedly there is a patent pending. <hr /></blockquote>What's "local"?

Thierry Layani ( http://www.layanicues.com ) cues have a conical fit, so the contact areas between the shaft and butt aren't flat-faced. A gap results between the faces. There is no spring in the joint, to my knowledge. Unless Thierry has done something magical, his regular shafts do squirt as a normal shaft would. IIRC, he does offer a Predator shaft for those into such things.

The conical fit definitely reduces annoying vibration, which lends to the subjective "hit" definition. I love it. On a normal flat-faced joint, I think that shots with english will send a shockwave down the shaft (sine wave) that will separate the flat-face contact. That separation and re-contact I think is part of the noise associated with some joints. I'd love to see a high-speed video to see if I'm completely off base. The Layani conical joint would seem to be less susceptible to that separation (and resultant noise).

Fred

Rich R.
04-03-2003, 10:43 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Pizza Bob:</font><hr> I also believe he may have patents pending. <hr /></blockquote>
I have heard rumors that Layanni cues violate a patent already held by Lambros Cues.
The joints on these two cues appear to be very different. I can only speculate that some of the physics involved, with the two joints, are similar enough to cause the patent problems. Since I don't know a darn thing about physics, I won't say any more about that.

Hopefully, Thierry will either dispute or verify any patent problems with these joints and maybe explain the similarities and differences.
Like I will understand. /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Fred Agnir
04-03-2003, 10:54 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rich R.:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Pizza Bob:</font><hr> I also believe he may have patents pending. <hr /></blockquote>
I have heard rumors that Layanni cues violate a patent already held by Lambros Cues. <hr /></blockquote>Unless Lambros has a patent on something completely different than what he offers for joints, I can't see any similarity.

Fred

Popcorn
04-03-2003, 10:57 AM
Lambros did, or does make a joint with a tapered fit. It is nothing new though, just look at the morris taper on any lathe. You can find the same concept in all kinds of products. Hard to believe you could patent such an old concept.

Rich R.
04-03-2003, 11:15 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Fred Agnir:</font><hr> Unless Lambros has a patent on something completely different than what he offers for joints, I can't see any similarity. <hr /></blockquote>
Fred, the joint in question is the Lambros "Ultra" joint. I don't believe he has a picture or much of an explanation of it on his website. I can tell you that it looks very different from the joint on Layani cues.
I'm still hoping Thierry can shed a little light on this for us.

Kato
04-03-2003, 11:41 AM
In addition to being a super nice guy Thierry makes one heck of a nice cue. I look forward to hitting a few balls with one some day.

Kato

Rod
04-03-2003, 12:31 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I'd love to see a high-speed video to see if I'm completely off base. <hr /></blockquote>

I'd love to see that video to.

~~~ rod wonders if fred smokes that road side stuff! /ccboard/images/graemlins/blush.gif

Kato
04-03-2003, 12:36 PM
Fred has mad knowledge that he got from eating "mad mushrooms" in the 60's.

Kato~~~has no idea what all those big words mean

Mike D2
04-03-2003, 04:22 PM
I have owned a Layanni cue and i didn't really care for the hit. It was a butiful cue but i really didn't want to get use to the cue. They hit nice if you are willing to give your self time to change.

04-04-2003, 06:49 PM
Years ago I was sold that the most important thing in a cue was the joint. After years of research, what I have learned is it's the tip first, then the ferrule, then the shaft wood, then the taper. You are on the wrong path here, the best joint, is no joint, ask any English snooker player. Fast Larry Guninger wwww.fastlarrypool.com
VENI, VIDI, VICI.....