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View Full Version : What constitutes a combination?



PeterP
05-17-2003, 12:44 PM
Newbie here, trying to get an understanding of the rules. I understand that if you hit the cue ball into the one-ball which in turn hits the two-ball into the pocket, that's a combination. But what if you pocket the one-ball by glancing it off the two-ball? Is that also a "combination"? The reason I am asking is in the official BCA rules, you can't sink the 8-ball legally (in a game of 8-ball) by a "combination". So if you hit the 8-ball and it glances off one of your opponents' remaining balls, into the called pocket, is that legal? My thinking is it depends on the definition of "combination" which I haven't pinned down yet. Thx for any input.

Rod
05-17-2003, 01:20 PM
Kissing off another ball is refered to as a carom. Some may say, combo the 8 off another ball though. It is legal to carom the 8 off your opponents ball and a win if you call the pocket.

Rod

Tom_In_Cincy
05-17-2003, 01:54 PM
PeterP,
A combination is using the same group ball (9-15 if you are shooting stripes and 1-7 if you are shooting solids) to directly hit the intended ball you want to pocket.

When shooting the 8 ball you don't have any of your group's balls left, so, you can't use a combination. You can't hit your opponent's ball to pocket the 8, because that would be a foul. The only ball you can leagally hit first when shooting at the 8 is the 8 ball.

But, you can hit the 8 first and then the 8 can hit your opponent's ball (this is called a carom) and the 8 go into your called pocket. Also, as long as you can hit your group's ball first, you can carom into your opponents ball (or even the 8 ball) to make the shot.. this is all very legal.

Hope this helps

PeterP
05-17-2003, 08:14 PM
Thank you.. this all makes sense. One more question, not that I would ever attempt such a shot, but would it be legal to use your opponent's ball or the 8-ball in the middle of a multiple ball combo, say.. one-ball into 9-ball into two-ball which goes into the pocket, or one-ball into 8-ball into two-ball into pocket.. ??

Rod
05-17-2003, 08:22 PM
Yes as long as you hit your ball first you can use any combination of balls.

heater451
05-17-2003, 11:36 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rod:</font><hr> Yes as long as you hit your ball first you can use any combination of balls. <hr /></blockquote>Also, depending on the rule-set, you can use ANY ball combo, while the table is open. For example, using a stripe to sink a solid.

Depending on the rule-set, you can also use the 8-ball first, while it's open. I believe the BCA changed this recently though--check your local ordinances. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

The 8 in the middle of, say, a three ball combo is also usually allowed, except in "bar rules", where many times you will be told that you can't use the 8 ever. This is usually brought up by those, "8-ball must go clean" guys.



=========================

Rod
05-17-2003, 11:48 PM
BCA allows number1. Number two is a no no in BCA. Number three, when at a bar always ask first. Man those guys do anything for a quarter. You know those are the last guys that should ever put such demands on a pool game.

Wally_in_Cincy
05-18-2003, 11:03 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote heater451:</font><hr> Also, depending on the rule-set, you can use ANY ball combo, while the table is open. For example, using a stripe to sink a solid.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is a legal, though often overlooked, shot in APA 8-ball. I always try to remind my newbie players of this. It doesn't come up often but it comes up enough that it can win you a game every dozen matches or so.

05-18-2003, 03:41 PM
Peter... For what it's worth. It's also legal to hit the 8 directly into one of your opponents balls, sinking it and have the 8 follow it into the pocket for the win. ....unless of course you're playing with those bar guys again /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif ...Bob

qSHAFT
05-18-2003, 06:35 PM
Hey Tom,

This was just discussed on RSB and Ron Shepard mentioned this shot which would be a legal combo on the black:

START(
%An8D2%Br2D5%GG8^3%Hn9E6%Pq9I9%Qs3[2%Uo5G6%Vp8I9%Wr9Z3%Xo0F8
%YU4J9%Zn6G1
)END

Cheers - qSHAFT

bluewolf
05-19-2003, 04:27 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Tom_In_Cincy:</font><hr> PeterP,
A combination is using the same group ball (9-15 if you are shooting stripes and 1-7 if you are shooting solids) to directly hit the intended ball you want to pocket.

When shooting the 8 ball you don't have any of your group's balls left, so, you can't use a combination. You can't hit your opponent's ball to pocket the 8, because that would be a foul. The only ball you can leagally hit first when shooting at the 8 is the 8 ball.

But, you can hit the 8 first and then the 8 can hit your opponent's ball (this is called a carom) and the 8 go into your called pocket. <hr /></blockquote>

Guess these thoughts do not enter my mind, except that combo is something I do on purpose and carom is something that just happens. And if ww tells me how to do the carom, it never goes in.

I guess as long as the correct ball is struck, it goes in or it does not go in.

Laura

Tom_In_Cincy
05-19-2003, 06:00 AM
bw,

If you remember back when you were trying to bank a ball into a corner pocket?.. and there was a 'helper' ball next to the pocket, close enough to be able to 'help' the ball you were banking, into the pocket?

Caroms are a good tool to have in your arsnal. Its good to practice them. Caroms come in very handy in 14.1 and one pocket.

bluewolf
05-19-2003, 08:12 AM
Yeah I know that you are right. It just seems that if I think about it, I miss. If I do not think about the carom, it just does it.

I also like using a rail to go around a ball that is in my way to hit mine in. That is the funnist shot of all.

Laura

PeterP
05-19-2003, 10:20 AM
START(
%An8D2%Br2D5%GG8^3%Hn9E6%Pq9I9%Qs3[2%Uo5G6%Vp8I9%Wr9Z3%Xo0F8
%YU4J9%Zn6G1
)END

What is this funky notation and where do I get the software to interpret it? Thanks!

Rod
05-19-2003, 10:27 AM
Go here, wei table (http://endeavor.med.nyu.edu/%7Ewei/pool/pooltable2.html) copy the code and use the green paste button to see the shot. You can make up a shot, copy from the table and past it here.