View Full Version : Safety Play
9 Ball Girl
05-19-2003, 12:06 PM
When you play a safe on someone, aren't they suppose to try to kick out of it? Yesterday I was playing against a friend, and I had already won 3 sets in a row. On this 4th set, I played a hell of a safe on him. He was already irritated with the fact that he was down 3-0, so he took the cueball and handed it to me and told me that he's not going to bother because it's a waste of his time. Now, ball in hand sounds good but I played a safe behind a cluster of balls that I'd hoped he would try to kick at and break 'em open. Isn't he at least suppose to try to kick at something? He also stops the CB halfway through it's run when he misses the OB completely stopping it from smashing into any other balls. Argh!
He doesn't have to kick at a ball. You can just pick up the ball and give it to you opponent, it's legal. What you can not do is stop the c/b if you do kick. That is call for unsportsman like conduct in a tournament. Just friends playing it's your call but I would certainly tell him about it. If your gambling I definately would tell him!
I would think in the spirit of competition they should. Since you're a SL5 perhaps you play such monster safe's that mortal man couldn't get out of your prison.
Kato~~~been in Sing Sing too many times to count.
Sometimes if I think the kick is a low percentage I forgo the kick attempt and just try to lock up another ball so with the ball inhand they will not have an easy run out...
05-19-2003, 12:37 PM
Sorry, NO Kicking Is Required. /ccboard/images/graemlins/mad.gif
Now, depending what rules you are playing by, you can attempt to put him back in the same place and win on 3 fouls. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Picking the ball up is fine ( I hate it when they do that /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif ). If they stop the ball with their hand or cue stick before it stops rolling, then I will say something. If it continues, then I don't play with that person any more.
I was in a tournament one time and we were hill hill, and my opponent missed his ob and stopped the cb from continuing down the table and freeing up one my of balls. The TD ruled it a loss of game. I win. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif
If it's 8 ball, I might even look at an intentional foul to lock up a ball and prevent a runout by my opponent. The last thing that I would want to do is to try a kick or any other maneuver that might be beneficial to my opponent.
05-19-2003, 12:48 PM
if i thought i was playing into a trap, and going to complete the phase "b" by opening up trouble balls...you bet I'll hand the ball to you. Now IF it is truly a very friendly type player I suppose an attempt would show sportsmanship, and yet why should they? Were you friendly with the snare you laid out???sid
9 Ball Girl
05-19-2003, 12:57 PM
Yeah, I hate it too I guess. It's all 9 Ball by the way. The thing is is that he knows better. He knows the rule. You should've seen this last time around. Bah! I made this nice carom shot to sink the 9 and he said I hit the 9 first. I didn't argue. It's not tourney play but my other friend who happened to be watching told me later that it was a good hit. I'm used to this from the friend that I'm playing with but still. When I'm losing I stay quiet and just keep trucking. This is the guy that I told you I played in another thread that gets real intense when he's losing but this time he was just unbearable. The ultimate was when I kept sinking balls in on the break, he'd tap the 1 ball when he'd rack and leave the last 3 loose, and when I was still making balls in on the break, he'd rack the balls with his hands and not the rack! /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif
05-19-2003, 12:59 PM
You can pick the CB up and hand it to your opponent.
But stopping it from rolling into a cluster is a no no..
I have a friend that has a habit of grabbing the cue ball while it's still rolling in ball in hand situations too. /ccboard/images/graemlins/frown.gif
I don't think it's intentional, and very few times has it been questionable, but I ALWAYS ask him not to when it happens.
Now the whole racking thing... that would piss me off. If you have to use that kind of strategy to beat me... why play me?
9 Ball Girl
05-19-2003, 01:15 PM
I'm always friendly while I'm playing. When I play a safe, I look at my handiwork to make sure that it's a good safe and I'll sit down. When he plays a safe, he's like "take that" and what not. I don't really care for that. I was told once that when I play him to try to let him win so that he doesn't get discouraged. Damn that!
05-19-2003, 02:04 PM
Wouldn't you like to see the shooters on TV do that one time? Karen Corr would play a great safe on Allison and just shout, "TAKE THAT!".
Seriously, your friend is a sore loser. I have a friend like that. I just avoid competition with him. This way we remain friends. I couldn't take those antics too long before my temper would burst.
Since your friend is a guy. He might have some sort of ego pride thing going and just doing anything he can to keep from getting beat by a girl. I've seen it. It's kinda funny.
05-19-2003, 03:30 PM
I gathered from your first post that you were asking whether the guy should have winga'd after the safe, and gifting you with a dispersion of some trouble balls, instead of simply handing you the BIH like he did. I missed your point, sorry...sid
I've seen that same thing... in ME! LOL - I lose to almost every woman I play against, especially the first time I play her. I have no idea why this is, but I gaurantee that it is mental.
A buddy of mine, his wife is a HORRIBLE pool player, I mean, she couldn't hit water if she fell out of boat. And still she beats me somehow every now and then.
A team we play in league has a really hot blonde girl that can really shoot. If she were a guy, I could beat her. In fact, I beat her boy-friend consistantly and he is much better than her. But they play her against me every time and I lose 2 out of every 3 matches! lol
WOMEN! Can't play with them, wouldn't be here if SOMEONE didn't!
05-19-2003, 03:47 PM
Turn it around on him. Put whity in solitary confinement. Remember he'll 3 foul out before you will /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
05-19-2003, 03:54 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 9 Ball Girl:</font><hr> so he took the cueball and handed it to me and told me that he's not going to bother because it's a waste of his time. Now, ball in hand sounds good but I played a safe behind a cluster of balls that I'd hoped he would try to kick at and break 'em open. Isn't he at least suppose to try to kick at something? <hr /></blockquote>I agree with you, 9BG. You get BIH when your opponent fouls during his shot. In this situation he hasn't taken a shot yet. One can't pass his shot whenever he feels like it. This is not to say that he cannot intentionally foul, but he has to strike the CB with his cue. I think if he doesn't want to take a shot, he forfeits the game.
05-19-2003, 04:06 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Alfie:</font><hr> This is not to say that he cannot intentionally foul, but he has to strike the CB with his cue. I think if he doesn't want to take a shot, he forfeits the game. <hr /></blockquote>
Nope, touching/picking up the cue ball is clearly a foul and ends his turn at the table. Nothing in the rules says he has to use his cue to intentionally foul.
FWIW, I wouldn't kick into a messy cluster and break it up for you, but I'd be aware of the chances that you could probably 3-foul me.
As for as stopping the cb on a miss before it breaks up a cluster, I'd warn the guy once, then just stop playing him if he continues.
Walt in VA
05-19-2003, 05:12 PM
1. Stopping the still-moving cueball from contacting clusters should be a loss of game.
2. While handing you the cueball instead of shooting from your safe may seem a little bogus, in most cases he could have just touched it with the tip and let you call foul from there anyway. In fact, you might rather him hand it to you because if you think about it he could also just touch it with the tip and still have the option of calling foul on you if you jostled another ball with it while picking it up.
In a friendly game, I'd let #2 slide but never #1.
05-19-2003, 05:28 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote WaltVA:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote Alfie:</font><hr> This is not to say that he cannot intentionally foul, but he has to strike the CB with his cue. I think if he doesn't want to take a shot, he forfeits the game. <hr /></blockquote>
Nope, touching/picking up the cue ball is clearly a foul and ends his turn at the table. Nothing in the rules says he has to use his cue to intentionally foul. <hr /></blockquote>Of course you're right. Brain glitch on me. (???)For some reason I was thinking 9BG's opponent had the CB in hand(???) and so it wasn't in play until it was struck.
9 Ball Girl
05-19-2003, 10:06 PM
You're all definitely right, that's for sure. I'm the one that's choosing to put up with it I guess. I just feel that I'm being anal if I start to "nitpick" at the things he's doing because he knows better, and I put nitpick in "" because it's actually the right thing to pick at. It just becomes frustrating when he gets pi$$ed off 'cause I actually start to feel bad! Obla-di Obla-da
05-20-2003, 10:39 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote 9 Ball Girl:</font><hr> . . .because he knows better. . . .It just becomes frustrating when he gets pi$$ed off 'cause I actually start to feel bad! Obla-di Obla-da <hr /></blockquote>It sounds like he's a combination of sore-loser/spoiled brat. If you continue to positively reinforce his behavior, by continuing to play with him and letting him act like an ass, then he'll always act that way.
Ask the English and the French about the effectiveness of appeasement. . . .
05-20-2003, 11:41 AM
What is the deal with sore losers anyway?! I also have a friend whom I play quite often and consistently beat. We play straight and lately it's been 2 to 1 as far as points. Sometimes I'll let up and just start losing interest in the game because it gets boring and he'll start catching up or even winning and start gloating. It ticks me off when I hear him talking like we're evenly matched; because we're not.
Is it a characteristic of pool players to set their modest attitudes aside as far as pool is concerned? I've noticed that I'm becoming more confident in my abilities and feel as though (unless there's no way in hell) I could beat anyone that comes into our small hall. Granted, I play straight.
You must really like beating up on this guy to tolerate all that craziness. Racking the balls with his HANDS? It's nitpicking to complain about that or grabbing a live ball off the table??? And I thought I was having trouble getting enough competition (at my lowly level, that is).
The guy is a moron or he is 8 years old.Qtec
05-21-2003, 08:24 AM
Once you start calling him on the 3-foul rule I am almost certain he will start making some kind of attempt of a shot, quit playing all together, or try to improve his game. Ultimately anyway he will stop handing you the cueball. LOL.
McCready was playing Fang in a Joss tournament. After playing a great saftey Keith said "welcome to America". He was beating Fang pretty badly and making him look like an amateur. Fang decided to take a time out and just walked over to Joe Tucker the TD and then proceeded to have a smoke. When Fang returned to the table Keith said "break time" and walked away. Fang stood there clearly puzzled until he figured it out and said "time out?"
Keith then put on a clinic in the finals beating Alcano 9-0.
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