View Full Version : Is Pool in a Depression?
06-12-2003, 03:02 PM
Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that our game is in a depression at the moment. The visible evidence is how many cue makers seem to be hurting. Nova closes, Dufferin files BK, Meucci, a company which used to introduce a new design every month is still pushing their 97 series.
Is pool in a depression?
06-12-2003, 03:37 PM
Seems to me that if you are looking at cue makers it is just the availability of many more makers at cheaper prices. The target price range for people who want the meucci type cues seem to be going for Lucasi instead. There are so many cuemakers anymore that you only have to step out your front door to find one. Because they offer comparible cues at cheaper prices and without the wait. You just aren't buying the name...which about what you get when you go out and buy a Porsche SUV. I mean if I had that much money to spend on one vehicle...I would buy a Explorer/boat/jetski/motorcyle for the same amount.
But then again...the popular cuemakers cue will appreciate in value where it would take the locals longer...if ever.
Guess its a trade off. But back on the subject at hand seems to me that pool is going pretty well with the number of personal cues I see in kids hands these days. Anyone who going into a pool hall has their own it seems.
Blah...I'm rambling....ready to go home....
06-12-2003, 03:52 PM
Pool is booming all over the world... well in Asia and Europe anyway. Some of the "old" cuemakers has gone down in quality and I thing thatīs what really is hurting them now. There are new kids in town...
I had to "coustom-make" a new shaft for my old Meucci to be pleesed. Didnīt use to be like that.
06-12-2003, 05:12 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Koenig:</font><hr> Pool is booming all over the world... well in Asia and Europe anyway. Some of the "old" cuemakers has gone down in quality and I thing thatīs what really is hurting them now. There are new kids in town...
I had to "coustom-make" a new shaft for my old Meucci to be pleesed. Didnīt use to be like that. <hr /></blockquote>
We have a very good 9 Ball player out here in Los Angeles from a small village near Goteborg. He tells me there are a lot of good pool players in Sweden and it's popular there too.
06-12-2003, 05:16 PM
Yes, weīll show you in the WPC. /ccboard/images/graemlins/wink.gif
06-12-2003, 05:22 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote UWPoolGod:</font><hr> Seems to me that if you are looking at cue makers it is just the availability of many more makers at cheaper prices. <hr /></blockquote>
No doubt about that - too many good cues and good cuemakers, custom and production. I am sure the imports have had a significant impact on American production cues and case makers.
06-12-2003, 05:34 PM
I was shopping around for custom makers three months ago. Kept coming up with a snag...money and waiting time. Now the money aspect didn't bother me, I had a fat tax return and was willing to blow a chunk on a cue I have wanted designed for a while. But the waiting 2-5 years did not appeal to me. When I found out a local player I know was making cues, I asked to try them out. Every one hit the way I like it, all hit the same, and being able to take it back to him right away with refinishing/tip work was a big bonus. Plus it was half as much as the cue I was looking in to. Now it might not have the same brand name on it, but when it knocks balls in just as well as the name brand, had to go with it. And the guy lives 4 miles from my parents so it gives me an excuse to go visit the fam. Should be done in three weeks. I have visited to see the building stages which gives me some satisfaction of knowing what steps were taken in my cue.
06-12-2003, 05:36 PM
But then of course I doubt that his cues will be valued as high as a Szamboti/Balabushka either...so there goes that investment.
06-12-2003, 05:43 PM
So who's the cuemaker, Todd. Come on details, man!
06-12-2003, 05:54 PM
His name is Larry Schave from Vancouver, WA. Shoots a good stick. Glen Atwell uses him for his practice dummy...so to speak. Maybe just a racker with Glen. HEHE. But he used to be a machinist and has always had the best equipment (Southwest, Scruggs, Schick, Bender, Coker). Another Vancouver maker who is busy also, sold him his specs and he began making cues. Once he started he found that he made a good cue and sold the others to buy more equipment. Sold his 2nd cue he ever made to a collector here in Seattle for $1200 I believe.
But this is getting off this thread, if you want his number you can PM me and I will give it to ya.
06-12-2003, 11:29 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rod:</font><hr> Yes <hr /></blockquote>
That's what I thought, in the U.S. at least. The manufacturers all seem to be hurting. So, Rod, what's going on exactly? Is it a popularity issue?
but i think the high end pool halls are worse off. they provide a diversion that their clientele can do without. their customers will go back to simpler venues,,,,,bars. so i think bar pool will survive. i think the pool halls that will be ok are the ones that are cheaper and cater to a more insulated demographic. like pool halls near college campuses etc.
the custom cues market has become oversaturated and outragiously expensive. i think the fat will be shaken out in this market.
a problem with pool in america is the it must battle other venues for the entertainment dollar. there are cheaper ways to get their bang for the buck in the US. this is not quite the problem in other countries, which is where the sport is so big. all they do in sweden is get drunk and watch morose bergman films. all they do in the phillipines is nothing.
06-13-2003, 04:31 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that our game is in a depression at the moment. The visible evidence is how many cue makers seem to be hurting. Nova closes, Dufferin files BK, Meucci, a company which used to introduce a new design every month is still pushing their 97 series.
Is pool in a depression?
In spite of the fact that the stock market seems to be recovering somewhat, still unemployment is at an alltime high.Many people have less to spend on recreational sports.
So I do feel that pool industry is suffering.If we did not have our own pool table at home, we would rarely get to practice at 7$ PER HOUR.Actually ww has a good job, but I think that things are tight for many folks right now.
So yes, i think that the pool industry is suffereing, but I also think that lots of other industries are suffering too.
06-13-2003, 07:19 AM
I dont think this is necessarily true. Pool/billiards seems to be very much alive. The best places in my area are always busy or fairly steady at worst. If you want to get on a table during peak times like week-ends, good luck. The line is usually long.
It is the cue-making side that appears to me to be suffering. I, like some one else already stated, was looking to buy a custom cue. The top cue makers seem to have become very stuck on themselves from the stand point that they are the most recognized and saught after. I turned to another cue maker for what I wanted and went with that person based off of several testimonials about his work. I think it is the small custom makers that will do best because it is not their livlyhood. More of a hobby and craft for them. I am sure I will be pleased with my new "Blackheart". And by the way, Yes, I think I got a great deal price wise. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
06-13-2003, 12:17 PM
I agree, Ralph. I feel Pool is in a transition for the better. Just look at the amateur pool leagues. Their numbers are exploding! There are leagues popping up everywhere and they are all growing at double digit rates(exactly how much, I don't know /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif) Here's another thought-look at Brunswicks 10K financials and see the growth in their Billiards division(if you really care to /ccboard/images/graemlins/tongue.gif). My point, though it's moderate growth, it's still growth.
Here's another thought-look around your area to see if there has been more Rooms opening up. I remember in the 80's, alot of the rooms in the NJ/NYC area dried up. Alot of bars took the pooltables out. Now, you have new rooms appearing again, and (be still my beating heart), every bar you go in has a table or 2. I think Pool is headed for a major growth period. I guess it's up to us amateurs to support the game.
06-14-2003, 10:14 AM
Like Eric said, some pools halls closed in Manhatten and maybe Brooklyn, I forget, and very few bars had tables in the eighties. That was definately a slump in this area. Then they started popping up again. I think it was after the Color of Money.
The following pool halls opened recently in Brooklyn, NY.
Carom Cafe 2(?) Grand St. Affiliated w/ Sang Lee(?) 2001
Name? McDonald Ave Midwood 2001
Name(?) 10 Tables 60th St. 9th/Ft. Hamilton Aves. 2001
Name(?) 10 Tables 86th St. Bensonhurst 2001
Park Slope Billiards 5th Ave/15 St. Dec 2001 Moved from Manhatten
Platinum Billiards ~ 50 Tables 47th/2-3 Ave. ~ Mar 2002
New Era Billiards 10 Tables 4808 8th Ave. ~ Nov 2002
Liberty Bar Beard St., Red Hook. 3 bar tables. 2002. First bar in Brooklyn to have more than one pool table.
No pool halls closed.
The APA started operations in Brooklyn in the summer of 2001. They have about 50 teams now I'd guess.
I'd say pool is not in a depression in Brooklyn.
06-15-2003, 04:47 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote tateuts:</font><hr> Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that our game is in a depression at the moment. The visible evidence is how many cue makers seem to be hurting. Nova closes,
-Should have stayed at Schon...they are doing well-
Dufferin files BK,
-files chapter 13, "reorganization"
Meucci, a company which used to introduce a new design every month is still pushing their 97 series.
-made so many cues...why not sell the stock before resetting everything?-
Is pool in a depression?
-I dunno but pool puts me in depression-
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