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scrappy
08-14-2003, 08:31 AM
I was just wondering if anyone has any opinions
on the water buffalo tips.
What tips do you use and why?

Sid_Vicious
08-14-2003, 08:39 AM
I personally doubt that you'll find a better single layered tip than the black water buffalo tip. I also use the brown Sumo tip as well, it is a nice super-hard tip. The black one is a great all around tip...sid

SpiderMan
08-14-2003, 09:48 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> I personally doubt that you'll find a better single layered tip than the black water buffalo tip. I also use the brown Sumo tip as well, it is a nice super-hard tip. The black one is a great all around tip...sid <hr /></blockquote>

The black WB is a good play tip if you like really hard (harder than Triangle) tips. The brown WB in my opinion is too hard. It has finer grain and higher density than the black WB. I use them on my break stick.

SpiderMan

pooltchr
08-14-2003, 10:53 AM
Last time I needed to replace a tip, I tried one of the high quality, high dollar laminated tips. Lasted about a week and I cut it off and went back to the WB. I have not found anything I like any better, although I am not really looking either.

KerryM
08-14-2003, 03:26 PM
I have been using the Black WB single layer water buffalo tip for a while now on my break cue, which is a Predator BK. I think this tip turned a good break cue into an amazing break cue. I couldn't imagine a better break tip, though I will be trying out the brown tip soon. I was told that the brown one was not as hard as the black. I put a brown one on my playing cue myself. I squished it in an arbor press first, with the intention of taking all the mushrooming out all at once. I find that WB tips mushroom severely at first, then they pack into shape and maintain their shape well. Anyway, the brown tip was just too hard to play with. It seemed harder than the black one. It made a distinct "click" when it hit the ball. I think taking one of those brown ones, doing the same thing with the press (a vice would work fine, I'm sure), and slamming it on my break cue would be the coolest thing ever for breaking. Maybe the black one would be ok to play with?

KerryM

Rod
08-14-2003, 04:33 PM
Kerry,

Cut the brown one off and use it as a break tip. It doesn't need to be all that tall.

I'm still trying to figure this one out. To me the brown is a softer tip, it will mushroom a little. Next I'm betting the tips' mixture has been changed a little. The dark one,(near black) was the harder tip. We either have a mixture change or these tips are made by more than one company. Of course it is possible someone got a hard brown one and think there all the same. I got one (1) very hard brown one from schön, I busted a chunk out, about 1/4 of the tip.

Rod

Sid_Vicious
08-14-2003, 07:06 PM
"To me the brown is a softer tip"

Spiderman and I have mutually had much the opposite experience with the brown WB tips we got together along with the black ones. Maybe they are in a batch that came out that way, different from those manufactured when you got yours. I dunno the exact answer but our brown ones even push my hardness desires...sid

SpiderMan
08-15-2003, 12:32 PM
Ditto that sentiment. I bought my brown WB and black WB tips from the same vendor, withing a month or so of one another, and the brown is definitely harder.

One thing I will agree with, though, from Rod's post. The brown WB will mushroom a little, despite being the hardest tip I have ever used. I guess I'd describe it as "cold flow" or "creep", such as what you experience with a piece of iron if you bang on it with a hammer, but it definitely does lose shape somewhat. Doesn't mean that it isn't the hardest, just that it doesn't spring back as completely.

The black WB tips will tend to "flare" where the crown meets the sidewalls, while the brown WB will tend to bulge the sidewalls a little closer to the ferrule.

SpiderMan

Cueless Joey
08-15-2003, 01:13 PM
This must be the new black.
The black one used to be so hard it was only used on breakers. The brown one was hard but playable. It was noisy though. I remember when the brown one just hit the states. Best Billiards promoted the hell out of it. People at the store complained about it's nasty smell. /ccboard/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Judd used to like them in his cues before all these layered ones came out.

Rod
08-15-2003, 01:16 PM
I know little of the black because I had them cut off in two weeks or less. But it sounds like a fairly close description of both tips. The only difference being, IMO, the brown was a softer tip. I had those on over two years. The same tip guy put on two blacks and said, oh there the same. What an ass hole or an idiot that doesn't know there is quite a difference. He's been mentioned here before, I won't let him touch my cue now. These tips may have changed some over the last few years.

Rod
08-15-2003, 01:19 PM
Joey,

The ones I talk about is the one with a plain WB on the box.
Yes the old black ones were very hard, but I liked the old brown ones for play.

Rod

AndyG
08-18-2003, 11:21 AM
Joey, My experience agrees with your's and Rod's. The older black ones were rock hard, and the lighter brown ones were a little softer, suitable for playing.

Recently we've had several of both black and brown break off in chunks. I sold a new Schon last week, and within the 1st hour of play, a chunk of the tip came off. This particular Schon had been in my display case for about 6 months. This was the 1st problem I've had with the WB's that came on the Schon. Evan had told me over a year ago, that they had the WB's 'double pressed' and made specifically for them.
AndyG

Rod
08-18-2003, 11:57 AM
Andy,

I find some difference in Schon's tips. I guess that is unavoidable. I blew a chunk out of the side of my Schon tip. I believe that is twice.

Rod

SPetty
08-18-2003, 12:38 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rod:</font><hr> I blew a chunk ...<hr /></blockquote>Hey buddy, I've blown chunks before, too. I hope you feel better soon. /ccboard/images/graemlins/smile.gif

(Sorry, couldn't resist)

Ralph S.
08-18-2003, 03:17 PM
Same here Spiderman. I use the brown WB hard on my break cue. Them suckers are about damn near as hard as a rock LOL.

SpiderMan
08-18-2003, 03:37 PM
Between my two boxes, the black WB are by far the strongest smelling. I attributed it to the coating on them. The browns, while harder, didn't have near the coating or the smell. The browns look as if they may be made from a pultruded mixture of leather fibers and some sort of binder, with little overcoating. They are smooth surfaced, as if from a mold, while the blacks look rougher. Both boxes have identical markings.

SpiderMan

AndyG
08-18-2003, 05:46 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Rod:</font><hr> Andy,

I find some difference in Schon's tips. I guess that is unavoidable. I blew a chunk out of the side of my Schon tip. I believe that is twice.

Rod <hr /></blockquote>

Rod, As you say, I suppose it's unavoidable. Seems as though everytime I find something I really like, it's immediately changed.

I use Lucasi one piece cues in my room, and replace them every 6 months. The 1st few times I did that, I never had to even replace a tip. The last 2 replacement batches have had a high rate of tip failure. I don't know if they've changed tips or what, but it's annoying to get into a routine and then find that it no longer works.
AndyG

Rod
08-18-2003, 07:17 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Andy G
Seems as though everytime I find something I really like, it's immediately changed.

<hr /></blockquote>

What's the deal with that Andy? I have thought that on and off for years. It never fails they change the mixture, when it is selling well. I guess they find something or someone
to save a fraction of the cost. Then it is junk just like some other products. When something sells, the last thing is make a change.

Rod