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c.holtz009
09-03-2003, 12:47 PM
Hi y'all!!
I've been away from the board for a while, but now I'm back.
Recently, a new pool hall opened up near here. So, the guy that owns the existing one here, decided to re-do all his tables. New rails, stripped down, re leveled, and re covered. Now, he is putting Simoniz 860 on them.
Here's the part that I really don't get. He is having it installed upside-down. I think if you are going to put an expensive cloth on your tables, wouldn't it stand to reason that you put it on the right way? He said it is an "old pool hall trick". He seems to think it'll extend the life of his cloth.
Now, I've played on 860 cloth before, and I absolutely love it. Same with a lot of the players here. I didn't realize all this time that I was playing on upside down 860. It just seems like a BIG waste to me.
How about the rest of you?

bolo
09-03-2003, 01:52 PM
It is hard to tell sometimes what side goes up. But I don't know a reason you would do it on purpose. Be a shame to see all his work go to waste by being a nit in the end.

travin
09-03-2003, 02:47 PM
I don't understand what the difference is. It is a woven cloth, isn't one side the same as the other? Do they put some king of coating on it?

Todd

bolo
09-03-2003, 03:13 PM
One side has a knapp that stands up. You can see it if you look close.

rackmup
09-03-2003, 03:34 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> One side has a knapp that stands up. You can see it if you look close. <hr /></blockquote>
Oh Bolo...you silly man. Simonis doesn't have "nap" and that is in fact one of it's greatest selling features. Are you certain you're looking at real Simonis?
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote from the Simonis website describing 860 www.simoniscloth.com (http://www.simoniscloth.com):</font><hr> #860 - PROFESSIONAL TOURNAMENT CLOTH

Developed especially for 9-Ball.
Slightly Slower than the #760 Blend.
Combed Worsted Wool and high thread count assure long lasting wear.
Nap-free.
Will not pill or fluff.
Available in 66" and 78" widths.
Recommended for ALL Pocket Pool or Snooker games.
Available in Simonis Green, Electric Blue, Burgundy, Gold, Wine, Spruce, Blue/Green, Dark Green, Marine Blue, Black and Grey.
<hr /></blockquote>

Regards,

Ken (working on the upside-down installation question as we speak...)

Tom_In_Cincy
09-03-2003, 03:42 PM
Somonis does usually put its name on the cloth. So, if you can't read the name, maybe it is upside down.. other than that, I don't know that there would be any difference. LOL

It's not an uncommon practice to flip the cloth to get an extra few months out of the old cloth before replacing.. but then you have to have a table mechanic to do it and that costs money.. I would sooner recover than go thru this 'flipping' process.

Rod
09-03-2003, 03:48 PM
Ken,

The back side does have nap. It's not sheared or cut clean like the front side. I have no idea why someone would put it on backwards. It just tells me the only person he is fooling, is himself.

I once used the back side on a couple of bar table rails, We run out of cloth, it was replaced within a week.

Rod

rackmup
09-03-2003, 03:49 PM
From the good folks at Hawley's (http://www.billiardsstore.com/table_fabric_simonis.cfm) :

[ QUOTE ]
Installation ... When installing your felt, Simonis fabric is to lay Logo Side Up, or the smoother side up. <hr /></blockquote>

Hope this lays this mystery to rest.

Regards,

Ken

rackmup
09-03-2003, 03:51 PM
I was just passin' on the info from Ivan himself.

I would assume, like most people have seen, that the "Simonis" screened logo goes face up.

But what do I know? I can't even run three friggin' balls.

Regards,

Ken (for all we know, neither can Ivan.)

Fred Agnir
09-03-2003, 05:25 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote rackmup:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> One side has a knapp that stands up. You can see it if you look close. <hr /></blockquote>
Oh Bolo...you silly man. Simonis doesn't have "nap" and that is in fact one of it's greatest selling features. Are you certain you're looking at real Simonis? <hr /></blockquote>

I don't know about Simonis, but I have a piece of yet-to-be-installed Granito Basalt. It definitely has a front side and a back side. I don't know if the back side would be considered "nap," but I know it's not the same as the front.

Fred &lt;~~~ plays on Mali

bolo
09-03-2003, 05:26 PM
As usual, more interested in being sarcastic and don't have any idea what you are talking about.

rackmup
09-03-2003, 05:29 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> As usual, more interested in being sarcastic and don't have any idea what you are talking about. <hr /></blockquote>

Bolo...loosen up your namesake. It's too tight and cutting off oxygen to your brain.

The info is from Ivan Simonis' website. Why don't you tell them they don't know what they are talking about?

Regards,

Ken (that wasn't sarcastic, was it?)

bolo
09-03-2003, 05:43 PM
You know from personal experience of what you speak, or do you just parrot back bits and pieces of things you read, pretending to know something? Sad.

c.holtz009
09-03-2003, 05:49 PM
From what I understand, he has always installed the cloth upside down.
The side he has facing up has a nap to it. The other side doesn't.
With the nap side up, I find the cueball tends to grab the cloth on shots where you use extreme right or left, and will swerve even with a level cue. I find the other side (the smooth side) doesn't do this.
I'm still learning about table mechanics, so I figured some input would be good. Thanks a lot and keep it coming.
When this thread dies, I'm going to print it out, and show it to the guy. He doesn't listen to anyone. We've told him a few times not to waste a good cloth like that.
I figure if he's going to put it on upside down, he might as well go to a local fabric store, and buy some stuff for 55 cents a square yard. But that's just my 2 cents.

rackmup
09-03-2003, 06:38 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> You know from personal experience of what you speak, or do you just parrot back bits and pieces of things you read, pretending to know something? Sad. <hr /></blockquote> If I don't know from personal experience, I will research it as I did with the Simonis cloth question. What you call "parroting", I call "valid time and effort spent to help a man with his question."

You said Simonis has "knapp". Mr. Simonis says otherwise. I guess I'll just have to believe him on this one.

I do know from experience that you are one who does not like his posts challenged, his knowledge questioned or his spelling errors pointed out.

This all probably leads back to a basic lack of understanding, education and rudimentary people skills.

But on that, I'm just "parroting." Research to follow.

Regards,

Ken

bolo
09-03-2003, 06:52 PM
So in one of your other posts you say that you read to install it with the smooth side up. What does that imply? It implies one side is not smooth, not tough to figure out. He just asked what was the difference between the two sides and I answered him. I can't help it if you can't process what you read. You are more interested in trying to find fault then fact. To do research you still need to know something about the subject or you can't understand your findings. Don't be so quick to criticize. Then you throw in comments like oxygen to the brain, what does that have to do with anything?

rackmup
09-03-2003, 06:58 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> Then you throw in comments like oxygen to the brain, what does that have to do with anything?
<hr /></blockquote>

Exactly.

You are w-a-y too high strung. Relax. Breath deep.

The presence of a smooth side doesn't necessarily indicate a "rough" side. I have a six inch square piece of 760 and 860 here in my hands. Sorry...no NAP.

One side is a little more "polished" than the other and that is about the only difference I SEE.

Grab a piece of your Simonis and tell me what you SEE.

Bolo...are you Fast Larry?

Regards,

Ken

bolo
09-03-2003, 07:02 PM
I am debating with the village idiot, believe what you wish. I can explain the polished effect but lets see if you can figure it out.

rackmup
09-03-2003, 07:09 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> I am debating with the village idiot, believe what you wish. I can explain the polished effect but lets see if you can figure it out. <hr /></blockquote>

Oh p-l-e-a-s-e Mr. Bolo...bless us with your divine and infinite wisdom. Master of all that is known, please bestow upon us the mass of information that rests on your lips. Please do not keep us craving for this knowledge any longer.

Good grief Bolo...get a grip.

And I'm not the "Village Idiot." Mansfield is much bigger than a village. I am the TOWN IDIOT.

Regards,

Ken (Okay...this is boring. Next?)

Billy
09-03-2003, 07:30 PM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote bolo:</font><hr> One side has a knapp that stands up. You can see it if you look close. <hr /></blockquote>

this is correct without a doubt

you have to look close but there is certainly a visible difference

why someone would want it upside down is a mystery /ccboard/images/graemlins/confused.gif

imo