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Sid_Vicious
09-20-2003, 11:47 AM
What purpose is there in having the varnish several inches away from the joint collar? I'd like shafts unfinished consistently down to the collar, that way the color actually adds character rather than distrastion(IMMHO)...sid

Popcorn
09-20-2003, 03:38 PM
This is not definitive but it is an answer. Because of the collar designs, most need finish on them. The phenolics look real bad without finish. You would have to do some finishing either way, so most cue makers just spray about the first 6 inches. It would be no problem to just mask off the collar and spray only that area though.

Rod
09-20-2003, 04:00 PM
As mentioned it might not look as good, but I always figured where the wood meets the phenolic it needs to be sealed from the elements. Seems to me with to much humidity the wood could swell and cause a crooked joint. Plenty of those around. Some only spray a couple of inches past but at least it's sealed where it meets the wood.

Rod

SPetty
09-20-2003, 06:21 PM
I'm not a cue maker, but I recall reading somewhere a long time ago that the finished part of the shaft was simply for help in screwing and unscrewing. It took/takes more usage than the rest of the shaft, so it gets a little more protection. It provides a little more "grip" action and is easier to keep clean.

BLACKHEART
09-20-2003, 07:36 PM
I've test hit some of my Qs, before they had the clear coat finish sprayed on them. & wasn't too crazy about the hit. Then I sprayed the finish on them & hit with them again. WOW the Q was more solid & had a truer hit. The finish DOES EFFECT THE HIT by sealing the wood & keeping the vibration flowing from the tip to the hand( this is what is refered to as FEEL). To go one step forward, my brother ordered a Q with NO finish on the shaft, past the joint collors(which strenthen the shaft at the joint). The feel or hit didn't seem to be affected...JER

Sid_Vicious
09-20-2003, 10:11 PM
I have 3 Viking shafts which apparently are unvarnished the total length, one shaft being "old wood" and seemingly colorless after all this time. Reality is that the entire length is speckled deeply with some of the same stuff we all get, just not noticable to the human eye cuz it blends so well. Frankly speaking, those shafts hit very good, especially the oldest one. I am not discounting your analogy, and yet this isn't what I'm finding in the one set of naked shafts I own...sid

BLACKHEART
09-20-2003, 10:33 PM
SID; reread your post, I'm not understanding what you're trying to say...JER

Sid_Vicious
09-21-2003, 07:52 AM
JER...The post I made about the Viking shafts was just to say that they play really well and appear to be unvarnished all the way to the collar. You seemed to lean toward having the varnish put on down by the collar, I believe you to say that you experimented with hitting with it without varnish and then with the varnish added, and the added varnish improved the hit. All I was saying was that the 3 shaft of the Viking without apparent varnish really play well like that. Maybe they could play better with varnish and I don't know it cuz they've always been like they are. I find it appealing to have them not showing their stain line, and still working like they do. These shafts was what prompted my original question, thinking that if I ever made a commitement to have a special cue built, I might select to leave the varnish off completely. It does not sound all that clear cut now as to whether that is the best idea, considering what has been said about an improved hit following varnish being applied...sid

BLACKHEART
09-21-2003, 09:04 AM
SID; I just reread MY POST. It say that the shafts I made WITHOUT A CLEAR COAT finish didn't, seem to play any different than those that had a finish. On the other hand I said that a WHOLE unfinished Q, seemed to play different than a FINISHED one.As far as shafts go , I have never seen a shaft leave the Viking factory without a finish sprayed down past the joint. If you bought it, or the extra shafts used, maybe the finish had been sanded off...JER

Sid_Vicious
09-21-2003, 09:58 AM
Maybe the one's I have are sealed better, maybe they are varnished completely or maybe I'm not seeing the transition even though I did put the maginifier hood on just now to verify, I dunno, but I bought two of the shafts from Viking to replace stolen ones several years back. All I do know is that I can't see color on any of them, except fot the oldest shaft, and it does appear to be hidden in the entire length, basically invisable. If I digitally photo'd these up real close, could I e-mail them for your observation? I'm just curious now that we've conversed to see what you might think. I have a very good digital camera, but to get resolution, I'll need to shoot full pixel which will make a sizable file size. Do you have a fast connection.

Sorry that I missed your report about the shaft playing no different, brain cramp on this end...sid

BLACKHEART
09-21-2003, 10:45 AM
I do have a fast connection, so go ahead & send a pic. Just as some extra info. Cuemakers especially ones making large quantitys os cues, don't know how long their product will sit on a store shelf. In this case they often spray a clear finish over the whole Q, to protect against warping due to changes in humidity. I personally burnish in several coats of good wax(HOG SHINE). This protects the Q during shipping,but wears off quit quickly, once you start to use it...JER

Fred Agnir
09-23-2003, 09:41 AM
<blockquote><font class="small">Quote Sid_Vicious:</font><hr> What purpose is there in having the varnish several inches away from the joint collar? I'd like shafts unfinished consistently down to the collar, that way the color actually adds character rather than distrastion(IMMHO)...sid <hr /></blockquote> I can think of two things.

Finishing the end possibly reduces the amount of end-grain humidity issues. I've seen a few joint collars fall off of shafts that weren't finished at the joint. Could be coincidence, but it seems to make sense.

Secondly, I think your hand has something to grab (on the finish) when you're screwing and unscrewing your stick.

Fred

Jim Buss
09-25-2003, 01:57 PM
If you didn't spray the first few inches of the shaft, then you'd see high gloss on the butt suddenly becoming dull when you pass the joint. Spraying the shaft allows the cuemaker to transition from high gloss to a flat dull unfinished (but sealed) shaft.

Visual only. The spray does nothing to keep moisture from the end grain of the shaft

Jim buss
http://www.jimbuss.com

Fred Agnir
09-25-2003, 02:10 PM
Welcome to the board, stranger.

Fred

Popcorn
09-25-2003, 02:15 PM
I hope you will be a regular. Look forward to your opinions.

Voodoo Daddy
09-25-2003, 03:17 PM
Gonna have to follow suit and welcome you Jim...your opinion will be well recieved here &lt;by a few smart listeners&gt; /ccboard/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Big Steve~~~owned a BUSS and knows the quality